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Iclone 6 wishlist!

Posted By planetstardragon 13 Years Ago
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animagic
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Posted 11 Years Ago
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@Viking: You SHOULD type less... :P

My naming is similar, but shorter: for example, for "The Lost Client", Scene 10, rev 1, it would be LC_S10_1. I cycle between three versions and add an "e" to indicate which is the last one: e.g., LC_S10_2e. This approach has minimized my confusion...:unsure:

That said, I do agree with your proposal. :D

It would be even cooler if you could actually automate this and tell iClone to keep a set number of versions. :cool:


https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/436b0ffd-1242-44d6-a876-d631.jpg

rampart
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Posted 11 Years Ago
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Now that I've been doing videos with iclone around 2 years I conclude there is one tool we need.

We need a tool like I have seen with other animation builders. A tool that makes movement, especially avatar walking, running and such easier. I'm OK with the motion editor and motion puppet for upper body movements. The most difficult and tedious processes are with the avatars walking, running, crawling and other movements from one place to another. The path command has it's own set of anomalies. Placement of paths close to each other and then trying to get avatars to follow specific paths doesn't always work well.

This video is from muvizu another animation software. This is terrific movement tool from what I can tell, and would save hours of time for basic movements of avatars in scenes with alot of avatars, walking, standing, sitting, standing, turning in place, etc.


http://www.muvizu.com/Video/17237/Tutorial-19-Directing-Character-movement


When we use the path command it takes so much time to get the character just to go where it should. Then you have the problem of motion content items that have to be started with the avatar in specific positions.

How often I have used a path command to move character across the screen and when I apply motions the avatar will do a turn. It is a pain getting the avatar going the way it should. In fact, this usually requires some kind of workaround to get the avatar to move the way you want it.

How many times I've use motion tools after I have moved the avatar to the end of path, and then when I applied the motion tool the avatar turned around and started off in that direction. How many times have I just wanted the avatar to stop at the end of a path and turn around facing the direction it came. This takes workaround to fix.

I realize there are so many other motions we can do in iclone, but why not have something simple like the video above as well. I mean we have motion editor, motion puppet.

Currently, I am working on a project where about 9 characters are walking around and moving within each scene. It is so time consuming and tedious, especially where paths cross each other or too close to each other.

I may be repeating myself here, but my experience is relevant to me.
I worked on a airport scene at the ticket counter and it drove me nuts getting all the proper walking and motions associated with the legs and turning of the avatars. Busy scenes with many avatars and alot of independent movement of avatars walking, sitting down, standing up, turns while walking, turns while standing in different directions can take hours and hours of work.

I don't care if we still have the path command, it works for flying and things like that. It is just that when paths are close to each other or cross over each other, the avatars exceed the path, don't terminate the path properly, get lost and pick path of another avatar, etc.

Seriously, the path command stinks and it needs work.

Simpler ways to do things is a very powerful message. Muvizu may not be a contender now, but they do have simpler ways of doing things...that will eventually register with alot of people. That is, if they can stay in business of course.

Time is important to me and I am not alone in this. I am constantly pressed for time.

I have an iclone project right now that I have put on hold, which should have been completed long ago. It has a large number of avatars in each scene and all those movements will take days of work to do to complete the movements in the scenes. All that tedious work is not motivating me.

It isn't fun...that is sure, and so often frustrating when things don't work as they should.

RL pays attention when it comes to things they really want to do or fix. This is not my first posting about the paths, nor the last RL is going to get about the way avatar movement is facilitated.





Magique
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Posted 11 Years Ago
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I agree on the improved animation tools needed. I posted earlier about emulating a tool called Maestro 2 for animation capabilities. I took a look at Muvizu and I think it's animation looks great. So much, in fact, that I'm downloading and taking a look at the product. Animation in iClone has always been frustrating to work with.




justaviking
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Hey, look, Rampart almost typed as much as me!  :w00t:

 

(~almost~)  :P



iClone 7... Character Creator... Substance Designer/Painter... Blender... Audacity...
Desktop (homebuilt) - Windows 10, Ryzen 9 3900x CPU, GTX 1080 GPU (8GB), 32GB RAM, Asus X570 Pro motherboard, 2TB SSD, terabytes of disk space, dual  monitors.
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rampart
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Viking

Sure hope some of these long-winded postings create some interest. I was really telling the truth. I really reached my threshold for working with the path command trying to get something done with avatars walking, turning, stopping and turning, then applying motion files has worn my patience thin.

I have never used the director mode. It may be I can do something with that. I'll give it a go later in the week.

I need to finish a project I started couple months back, and I keep trying to get my giddy up to work on it, but it won't giddy up





justaviking
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rampart (4/29/2014)


Sure hope some of these long-winded postings create some interest. I was really telling the truth. I really reached my threshold for working with the path command trying to get something done with avatars walking, turning, stopping and turning, then applying motion files has worn my patience thin.


Re "walking"... That is one of my greatest frustrations with iClone.

Foot sliding?  Arrrgh!!!!  It just shouldn't happen!!!

Short walks.  It seems nearly impossible to have an avatar take a mere two or three steps.

Turning.  A lot of turns are not natural.  It should also be easier to turn without going anywhere.

Stop HERE.  Many times when I tell an avatar to walk to a specific location, it goes two or even three extra steps, which means my avatar ends up walking into a wall, or stands in a mailbox.  Sometimes he doesn't go far enough.



iClone 7... Character Creator... Substance Designer/Painter... Blender... Audacity...
Desktop (homebuilt) - Windows 10, Ryzen 9 3900x CPU, GTX 1080 GPU (8GB), 32GB RAM, Asus X570 Pro motherboard, 2TB SSD, terabytes of disk space, dual  monitors.
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moviemachine
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Posted 11 Years Ago
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"Re "walking"... That is one of my greatest frustrations with iClone.
Foot sliding? Arrrgh!!!! It just shouldn't happen!!!
Short walks. It seems nearly impossible to have an avatar take a mere two or three steps.
Turning. A lot of turns are not natural. It should also be easier to turn without going anywhere"

Hey what's everybody getting worked up about?
Why I bet the team is addressing these issues as we speak!
Why I remember when Iclone 5 was released and Reallusion nearly marched all the G2 characters into extermination as the G2's were not rigged for IC5's whiz bang new technology.
Luckily though, the G2's were given an 11th hour stay of execution as the Team figured out how to get them back in the game!

So fear not!
All this gripping about wanting basic reliable control & implementation of avatars walking & turning (something that should have worked properly since IC3) will probably be addressed in IC6... you people are just expecting too much;)

Why I bet there's someone on the Team right at this very moment with an idea to have all the Avatars take on immobilizing disabilities that will prevent them from having a need to turn or go anywhere. Yes, from the nobody moves nobody gets hurt safety of their wheel chairs all the Avatars from G1 to G6 will raise their eyes to the Reallusion heavens and marvel at all the IC6 whiz bang "Effects" and they will feel privileged to have sacrificed once again for the Team.

Yup, screw basic simple moving from point A to point B
Who wants to animate human interaction or actually tell a story anymore.

Bring on the IC6 shell game:D
Magique
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Moviemachine is being sarcastic, of course, but I totally agree. And although I am a big proponent of lots of the new features coming to iClone 6, I still think that the fundamentals of animation need to be strengthened in this next version or iClone is never going to be a usable product for anything other than fanboy films by wannabe filmmakers. Great animation tools will make or break this product and so far it has broken it. I continue to hold onto the dream that iClone will someday overcome these hurdles and be my dream animation tool, but it continues to disappoint in this area.




rampart
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Magique

I suspect the reason RL keeps embracing the path for animations for walking, turning, and moving your avatars around in your scenes to keep selling motions. All the old standalone motions should no longer be relevant. We have the processing and graphic power now to get things working for us.

RL should move away from the standalone motions sales and move to built in motion tools that facilitate production. Walking is walking, turning is turning, running is running, what would it hurt to have basics for these types of motions and add some tweaking tools for altering those motions.

This is very important. iclone is an animation application and animation should be more competently addressed. RL needs to stop whatever they are doing, if it doesn't relate to improvements in building animations.



Magique
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Rampart, I agree. Reallusion needs to focus on great animation tools. Some people, including myself, have pointed them to other great animation tools that are far more advanced and capable than iClone. Pre-fab motions are great sometimes, but we need the ability to make great animations without pre-fabs and to be able to get characters walking and running without complicated setups. Poser is a great example of a tool that can generate walk/run cycles. I've pointed them to Maestro 2 for LightWave that has great tools for creating your own animations. And Messiah Studio is a great example of a product that has very animation specific tools for doing just about anything.

Animation is the key feature that will make or break iClone. Without it, you're never really going to see an explosion of AAA quality films. You'll always have the one or two dedicated people who know how to work magic from almost nothing, but even they would agree that better tools would give them a better end product and faster.







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