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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Dear Character Creator Users,
It's been 4 months since the launch of Character Creator 3 (CC3) and we hope the experience has been pleasant. Moving forward, we will talk about the features in store for you in 2019.
Serving up functions that add variety to characters and optimizing 3rd party engine pipelines have always been our goal as a universal character creation platform.
2019 will feature four major updates: Full Game Pipeline, HD Skin Generator, HD Film Base, Face Creation Plugin.
*Some new features may require the purchase of additional content and plugins.
Full Game Pipeline
Last year saw the beta launch of automation scripts / plugins for automatic shader assignments, animation re-targeting, and model configuration in Unity and Unreal.
Our ultimate goal is to make CC the go-to program for 3D character creation for Unity and Unreal. Besides enhancing scripts and plugins, we plan to release some updates for CC3 that include the following enhancements: - Unity & Unreal: Export of LODs are all embedded into one FBX file. Therefore, only one skeleton is needed to control all of the LOD meshes simultaneously within the engine.
- Unity
- A specialized hair shader is provided to overcome the unsightliness of the standard cutoff transparency shader.
- For HDRP Rendering Pipeline only: skin material will be supplemented with a Detail Map along with proper subsurface scattering (SSS) settings. We will also auto-configure eye and hair shader parameters when they are released for HDRP rendering in the near future.
- Unreal
- Customized Unreal Digital Humans shaders for hair, eyes, tongue, teeth, and skin. The skin will come with two shaders:
- HQ skin shader (high quality): using Unreal Digital Human as a base, we adjust the settings to up the ante on visual quality.
- LW skin shader (lightweight): based on the shaders from Epic Game's Paragon, we leverage their highly optimize skin shader without compromising visual quality.
HD Skin GeneratorThe long-waited Skin Generator for the Appearance Editor will finally be available in Fall of 2019.
This updated version will emphasize realism for human and human-like skin textures.
The novel concepts for the Skin Generator will be based on Real Human Skin and Makeup System. You will be able to adjust effects layers, change their ordering freely, then mix and match to your liking. This structural design will provide flexibility and maintain good performance for the workspace.
You can find explanation videos on the new Skin material concepts below.
*Examples provided are all proof of concept and do not necessarily represent the final product in functionality and user experience.Skin Base & Skin EffectsMakeup System
HD Film BaseBesides CC3 Base, CC3 Game Base, we plan to release a new character base to deliver film level quality to fulfill the demands in AAA Game, Film and Visualization. There will be subdivision mesh on certain areas of this Film Base to present high definition muscle & body details. With this subdivision mesh, the Film Base not only largely increases the variety of characters you can customize, but also be able to keep the details when transforming Daz, Poser, HiveWire models into CC. The facial expression will be enhanced with this new base too. Take Unreal Digital Humans for example, the creation of wrinkles from facial expressions is a natural occurrence that we take for granted and it is exactly the level of detail we will be striving for.
Besides the updates mentioned above, Joint Controlled Morphs will be integrated as well. Applying poses to a character can flatten meshes around bent joint areas, and in the past, you would utilize Pose Corrective morph sliders to bring back the natural curvature of the muscles in these flattened areas. Now we have incorporated the Joint Controlled Morphs (JCM) technology that will drive the naturalistic shape of the musculature based on the position of the bones. And this is all done automatically in real-time!Take the shoulders, arms, and elbows for example: New Content Type - Facial HairMost of you have expressed the need for additional content in the form of beards and mustaches. We will prioritize this request to develop content for facial hair that will conform and animate with facial expressions.*Examples provided are all proof of concept and do not necessarily represent the final product in functionality and user experience.For the time being, you may find creative approaches to facial hair in the Marketplace useful. These approaches include the use of Cloth and morph slider techniques that may be satisfy the needs of your projects.Face Creation Plugin for iClone & Character Creator
CrazyTalk 8 Pipeline has been the bulwark of customized 3D face creation for iClone & Character Creator for a long time now. However, there will be another face creation tool coming this year that can make the process of photo-to-3D face easier than ever! And more information will be revealed in the following months!
CC Content PacksBesides application updates and new plugin releases, you can look forward to some great content packs coming this year. Like Cartoon Morph and Cartoon Hair pack that lets you create Pixar-quality characters, HD Skin essentials pack for more human-like skin options, HD Film Base essentials pack, and much much more.
Take a sneak peek at the Cartoon Hair pack below.    More information will be revealed in the Content Pack Sneak Peak forum.
Looks to be another exciting year for all of us!
Please stay tuned for more to come! :)
-- Links of Official Comments: Feb. 15th, March 5th |
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By Waterlane Studios - 5 Years Ago
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This looks like an exciting year ahead and some great developments to come> :-)
One thing I feel is missing (please correct me if I'm wrong) is for eye rotation to effect the surrounding skin - i.e. when looking in one direction the eye pulls the eyelid and surrounding face in that direction too - it's one of the key reasons a lot of face animation looks dead. Will this be included?
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Mirinda (RL)
There are supposed to be many new wonderful new features for CC 3 in this roadmap.
But most only for the game developers and users of UE4, Unity and Co as well as DAZ users.
Pure IClone users are no longer available.
(Yes there are a few here who have bought the CC 3 pipeline)
The Appearance Editor for CC 3 Avatars only 1 year !!!! to be had after the release of CC 3 - well can not be changed (is stupid, that's the way it is)
The one the LOD plugin for pure IClone users not (or only limited) can use annoys me more.
That was for me the main reason to acquire CC 3 pipeline.
I asked before buying the opener,
whether you could use and receive diuese LOD's in IClone
It's true that I bring reduced LODs to Iclone via fbx and 3dx, but only if I use Iclone avatars with IClone clause (created from Assassin's base templates and Wizzard-Sorccers, as well as Essential-Pack, etc.) for which to export the license Has.
Export license for the use of RL-Kleber as iAvatar in Iclone !!!!! To equip my avatars, I would have to spend around $ 500.
So now I'm using DAZ-clause - and buying again.
Up to now meant it, it will be at the Erstelloung of LOD avatars
worked as iAvataren:
At the present time, InstalLOD and the Merge Material options are only available through the export panel when outputting to FBX. However, we do plan to allow these options to be available when you export to iAvatar as well. This is planned for a future upgrade coming in the first half of 2019.
Yes, you can use the game base option for a combined head and body texture but this doesn't include the other InstalLOD options. My point is that we do plan to make the InstalLOD options available for .iAvatar export as well via an upgrade later this year.
Was that just forgotten in the 2019 Roadmap?
or will it be until 2020?
or was this project completely "pulped"
and you can forget it?
Sorry about the "scolding" but that must be
Greetings from Germany
Postfrosch
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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SAME HERE!
The LOD function was my main reason to buy CC3 pipeline in order to get crowds in ICLONE.
That I still can't use it with my huge collection of Reallusion clothes without export licence is an ABSURDITY.
WHEN will this finally be available??
And the fact we still have to wait till fall 2019 for a functional appearance editor must be a joke...
NOT AMUSED :sick:
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By justaviking - 5 Years Ago
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THANK YOU for sharing the roadmap.
I would love to see subsurface scattering (SSS) added to the CC3/iClone suite, including SSS support in the iClone native renderer.
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By akuei2 - 5 Years Ago
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justaviking (2/1/2019)
THANK YOU for sharing the roadmap.
I would love to see subsurface scattering (SSS) added to the CC3/iClone suite, including SSS support in the iClone native renderer.
Yes, this is a point !
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By jasonjbrown - 5 Years Ago
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Thank you very much, Miranda.
Can you show a demonstration of the webcam facial capture? Any idea of what that will cost or what app we have to buy?
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By dante1st - 5 Years Ago
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If the HD Skin Generator will do what I think it will, this is literally my dream come true. Literally. It sounds like it's going to upgrade the looks of an existing character?
That's always been my fear, that since I don't just make one off videos and it's more like an ongoing "series," my fear has always been that as the technology improves, my main character (shown in my signature below ) Kyra, slowly looking more and more outdated. But it sounds like I can apply this realistic skin onto this already existing head, and essentially keep the same person?
If that is true, that would be great, that would prevent me from having to choose between continuity of the character by using the same "old" model, or upgrade to the newer, more realistic model which would be jarring, since I'd essentially be recasting a character.
I'm sure there will eventually come a point where the older models can no longer be "upgraded," so I'll have to prepare for that day with a storyline to explain why she looks different, but I'm glad I can use this FACE for the time being.
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By Rottadamic - 5 Years Ago
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if I may suggest an ad for the makeup > please also make-up for the eyebrows
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By Rampa - 5 Years Ago
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Have a close look at the AE videos. It looks to be a far more modular system that also allows for layer changes of different components. This means you can put a makeup layer on top of your eyebrows, if you wish.
Looks like a much easier to use UI as well! :)
The skins will still be a component you can save and apply to other characters as well. Keeping a character "current" will certainly be possible.
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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I think this all looks really great!
I have one nitpick with this. On the video with the guy with the facial hair beard, look how far back his teeth are.
I have seen this with the Virtual Humans too. The teeth are too far back, please design them so they are moved closer to the lips, it looks off.
THX!
COOL!
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By dante1st - 5 Years Ago
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TonyDPrime (2/2/2019)
I think this all looks really great!
I have one nitpick with this. On the video with the guy with the facial hair beard, look how far back his teeth are.
I have seen this with the Virtual Humans too. The teeth are too far back, please design them so they are moved closer to the lips, it looks off.
THX!
COOL!
Totally agree. I'll go even further and say that I actually prefer the CC1 and CC2 teeth over CC3.
Not sure I can explain it, but there's something odd about either the shape or color? It's like there's a black outline that's a bit too distinct on the teeth. Hard to explain, but if you look at a side by side, the CC2 teeth look 100% better than CC3 teeth (at least unmodified)
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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RL - You know how you have the thing now where you can bring in multiple poses now through 3DXchange (WHICH IS AWESOME!!!),
could we get something like that for the Daz textures, where we could bring in a multiple selection of texture files for conversion (as opposed to one per Transform import.)
IE - 3 or 4 faces/bodies/arms/legs for conversion on a character at a time, as opposed to just one.
THX!
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi everyone,
Thanks for your comments!
This roadmap only shows the big updates, while not revealing all details.
Welcome to write down all your questions, we will review all, and get back to you in mid-Feb. Thanks!
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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really cool improviments the road map, my only "sadness on that"is on the lack of morphs export to game engines" which at last for me could be a top priority, that is really a big feature which could make CC3 a real default tool for any indy developer and maybe some non indie,
Another important missing feature could be exporting only sepparated characters parts or cloths instead of the whole character to help speed up character customization system in the engines is really annoying have to export the whole character every time i just want a different cloth or something like that.
And for the last one question, some of that "extra" essentials things like hairs will come free??(for base CC) please or we gonna need to buy all of them???any chances for them be added on the base CC3???? if i've already have the essential pack i gonna be able to get them for free or it will be a "new essential pack?.
and another question for the make up and eyebrows and others face customizations will be possible to export it in sepparated textures like the cloths or when exporting to the engine it will baked in the main skin texture?? again for game develop could be much better if they can come sepparated like extra textures or in some cases like the eyebrows being a different meshe like the eyes and mouth the more customization is allowed outside the cc to the engine the much mire wanted it can become.
another good possible feature could also be able to use seamless textures(like the textures or materials from substance paint) to customize cloths and others things.
anyway really interesting features and looking foward for it, any plans for a "release date for some of the features?? like ending of the first year quarter or the ending of each quarter or something like that??
well keep the good work and thanks for a very good
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By Rampa - 5 Years Ago
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Between the mesh hiding option in the mesh edit tools and the delete hidden mesh in the FBX export, you can export any combo of clothing or body parts you want. You will always get a complete skeleton though. ;)
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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Rampa (2/6/2019)
Between the mesh hiding option in the mesh edit tools and the delete hidden mesh in the FBX export, you can export any combo of clothing or body parts you want. You will always get a complete skeleton though. ;)
well you still have to go to or blender or maya or any other 3d editor to delete the parts you don't want, if you just want a t-shirt or skirt you must export the whole body even after using the hidden/delete option it's only work for the "hidden" parts any exposed part will be still there and that is the problem, is much more easy if i can export just the t-shirt with the skeleton than have to export the body and go to a third part program to remove the not wanted meshes.
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By Rampa - 5 Years Ago
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Consider how you can use those two features I mentioned together.
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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Rampa (2/6/2019)
Consider how you can use those two features I mentioned together.
lol very interesting work around i give you that, but still could be good to have a more simplified and directly way to do that without have to be "creative"(working arounds) but for now it's really look working perfect.
thanks for the tip.
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By Brick Loko - 5 Years Ago
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Good news, thanks.
Looking forward for the Cartoon Morphs and Hair packs.
Best
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By Ascensi - 5 Years Ago
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Ok I have a few suggestions to make improvements.
I'd like to have the photo to face be able to accept both left and right profile pics and or all sides. if the head area had equilateral triangles (triangles for game engines) and the option to set density/tessellation a decent heightmap could be applied from a photo scan potentially to get great hair . Taking this further maybe it could be a different UV area specific for swapping out different hair heightmaps rather than importing just quads for hair. It doesn't have to be just for hair.. it could be alien or animal features or scanned circut board heightmap & color texture. To be able to pick a spot on the body aimed for tessellation/displacement and then have CC3 apply resolution to the LOD0 to that area might be helpful.
If someone has faceware or Liveface etc it might be ideal to use it to help automatically map where the eyes, ears, mouth, brows are etc (positional photoscanning ) or at least use it to test your character's facial expressions as you're manually building it..
I wonder where the advanced 3D photoscan to CC3 tutorial went? it's not added on the 2019 roadmap and it was supposed to come 2018-ish.
Also in the Skin Base & Skin Effects video it's missing soft tissue around the eyes.. usually this area is less porous and either lighter or darker based on ethnic background.
One last thing.. when creating the face from photo the example character picture dots doesn't match what official tutorials would teach when moving the marker, nor do things work properly when you move them to the same spots on the example. It shouldn't be complicated, move marker here = get accurate shape. The tip of the nose, nostrils and bottom lip area has got to be the most frustrating part to match.. if you move a marker from one view it changes incorrectly in another!! The example picture is also too small.
Perhaps you could provide your sculpting tools here rather than post work. Again I'd like to see how the face can perform with facial mocap default settings so no messing around later.. This might mean that you allow the users to define mocap markers for true expression.. maybe even create custom mocap profiles upon creation.
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By ultimativity - 5 Years Ago
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Thanks for posting this roadmap. Looks like some solid improvements are coming this year. The only photo to face generator that I have seen actually generate an accurate face from a photo has been Didimo. Hopefully your product will evolve using the same technology.
Nathan
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi everyone,
Thanks all for your feedback. All the comments have been carefully read and discussed internally.
Since some of the functions are in the evaluation stage, we are not able to reply to all the comments. Hope you understand.LOD iAvatar Export Remeshed iAvatar Export (comment link): Yes, it has been on the plan, but the release date is not firmed yet. --- updated on this post- Skin Generator - Is it going to upgrade the looks of an existing character? (comment link): Yes.
- Facial Expression - Eye rotation to effect the surrounding skin (comment link): It's in part of facial expression enhancement for the Film Base.
- Transformer - bring in a multiple selection of Daz texture files for conversion (comment link): No plan at the moment.
Ascensi & ultimativity,
The suggestions for Face Creation Plugin are great, we will definitely take into consideration when developing the tool. :)
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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dante1st (2/2/2019)
TonyDPrime (2/2/2019)
I think this all looks really great!
I have one nitpick with this. On the video with the guy with the facial hair beard, look how far back his teeth are.
I have seen this with the Virtual Humans too. The teeth are too far back, please design them so they are moved closer to the lips, it looks off.
THX!
COOL!Totally agree. I'll go even further and say that I actually prefer the CC1 and CC2 teeth over CC3. Not sure I can explain it, but there's something odd about either the shape or color? It's like there's a black outline that's a bit too distinct on the teeth. Hard to explain, but if you look at a side by side, the CC2 teeth look 100% better than CC3 teeth (at least unmodified)
Hi Tony & dante1st,
The appearance of Neutral character base is exactly the same as CC1's, so there should be no difference on their teeth.
Did you mean the default settings of the embed Female & Male character?
Can you share more information?
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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[quote][LOD iAvatar Export (comment link): Yes, it has been on the plan, but the release date is not firmed yet./quote]
This is a bad news for me.
So for me the purchase of the CC 3 pipeline was an (almost) useless purchase. I had previously asked umpteen times whether the LOD's for ICloen are nutbare or not. There was no answer or "Yes, these are all iAvatare, but that was not the case, I could NOT use the LODs in IClone with RL clothing unless I have the export version of the clothes. (Unnecessary money spent, since I was not on UE4, Unity and similar want to export)
With renewed (beginning November 2018 request it meant, an export of the LOD's as iAvatare would probably come with CC patch 3.04 or at the latest with 3.1 (1 Q 2018) Now 3.1 comes only in 3 Q 2019 (autumn 2019). At the moment I assume that an export of the LOD as iAvatar will never come in. Should the dumb customer buy the export versions of the clothes.
Now I'm really disappointed with RL for the first time in over 12 years. Sorry :ermm::crying::unsure::(
Greetings from Germany
Postfrosch
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By Rottadamic - 5 Years Ago
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a, good to hear that LOD is coming 4 ilcone.
I could realy has used it on my currend project, but, i managed without (only just)
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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a, good to hear that LOD is coming 4 ilcone.
Excuse me,
but where do you read that it comes?
Greets from Germany
Postfrosch
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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You guys DO know that you don't need this, right?
I mean, you can get *exactly* the same effect (well, near enough) just using the Polygon reduction in CC3 and then turning the Character into the game base. By doing this and then exporting to iClone you get a VERY efficient avatar (one I can dupe dozens and dozens of times without taking up even a GB).
I'm not sure if there's something I'm missing, but having an iAvatar LOD doesn't appear to be one of them.
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Again, perhaps I'm missing what you want, but I just took two minutes now and created 30 or so avatars, all with motions on them, and it doesn't even take up 1GB (and remember that iClone alone takes up .7 -- so these are all around .1 a GB, which means you could have HUNDREDS of these with no problem).
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By Rottadamic - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda (RL) (2/15/2019)
Hi everyone, - LOD iAvatar Export (comment link): Yes, it has been on the plan, but the release date is not firmed yet.
here.
ore isn't this for use in iclone?
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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I *thought* I'd read something about 'changes' being made for clothes that are simply intended for CC3 to iClone, (no intention of export *game* usage), so that you wouldn't be forced to purchase the (more expensive) 'export version' of the clothes. Is that correct? Is it the same with hair? I think I'm confused ....
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Oh -- is that the problem. You can't sent the avatar to iClone from CC3 if it has RL clothing/hair? That seems weird -- and I doubt that's true. Now, you can't export it via FBX, but I thought the two complaining here were strictly talking iAvatars (which are strictly iClone).
Sorry -- only got up an hour or two ago and may not be awake yet, but I still don't see the issue (at least with iClone -- I do understand the export via FBX of DRM items is a problem. I just don't use those anymore).
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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If you do not miss it is good.
What you show there is nothing new to me and I have to make it so inevitably. But if 1 Avatar 7000 Triangles incl. Weapons and accessories (as LOD) or still 30,000 Triangles - without armament and accessories (as Game Base) makes a difference to me. The avatars should not act alone in a blank screen but in an environment. And here the LODs as crowds would be much more effective. If I do not need more than 20 or 30, the game bases or maybe even the originals are enough for me.
But I am also concerned with the fact that I need an export license for the clothing for the use of an avatar with clothes made from RL-bases just so that I could even convert them into a LOD and use them in IClone 7 is incomprehensible to me. He does not leave the RL world environment. And to bring this fbx avatar (it is not more then yes) to Iclone, I need even synonymous 3dx (which I have though) That's not the purpose of the pipeline. Users who export to Unity and Co from CC 3 pipeline do not need 3dx (the export license for RL clothing, however, too - which makes sense).
Greets Postfrosch
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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I think we're having language barriers here, because I'm still confused. I've shown you can get hundreds of avatars in a scene without even using 1GB. And, yes, that would include armaments or anything else.
LOD isn't magic. It's doing EXACTLY the same thing as polygon reduction and turning to game base. The one and only difference is that all texture maps are combined to one, which *might* be somewhat significant but in actual practice it doesn't make that much difference if you plan carefully. And, trust me, LOD isn't a magic cureall. It has TONS of problems, particularly with opacity, and the results aren't all that good. In the end I suspect you'd not find it worth having anyway.
The export to FBX is a whole different matter, but LOD iAvatar is a waste of time.
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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And I'm still confused too. If you create a character in CC3, add clothes and/or hair, then you simply want to use that 'creation' inside of iClone at a reduced size (cos they're 'extras') - then when you attempt to export them from CC3 as fbx clothed characters, aren't you forced to use 'export liscence' clothes and/or hair? Rather, shouldn't it be that you're able to use 'non export' items in such situations (as mentioned by Postfrosch)? Or am I missing something here (which is quite possible).
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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As Postfrosch states: we WANT, as advertised, to be able to use "Remesher" from instaLOD to create crowds FOR iCLONE with RL Clothes.
For the moment we only can do that with clothes from DAZ/other import/no DRM export licence...
So, once again, RL PLEASE let us know WHEN this will be available!
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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Kelleytoons (2/15/2019)
Again, perhaps I'm missing what you want, but I just took two minutes now and created 30 or so avatars, all with motions on them, and it doesn't even take up 1GB (and remember that iClone alone takes up .7 -- so these are all around .1 a GB, which means you could have HUNDREDS of these with no problem).
Well, you have 830.000 polygons for 26 avatars, and your FPS went down to 31 without even having anything inside of your story, except the "filling crowd"...
What if you could load in 26 with 150.000 polygons?
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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AND!! We are talking about a SIMPLE DRM question!
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Polygons don't matter -- it's all down to GPU memory (I routinely have millions and millions of polys without problems -- but a simple badly constructed prop can bring my machine to a crawl).
And the DRM has nothing to do with LOD Avatars.
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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Kelleytoons (2/15/2019)
Polygons don't matter -- it's all down to GPU memory (I routinely have millions and millions of polys without problems -- but a simple badly constructed prop can bring my machine to a crawl).
And the DRM has nothing to do with LOD Avatars.
Well, if Polygons don't matter, FPS do, 31 FPS are only the half of 60 and you have no story told yet, except a little crowd...
And only DRM (no export licence) avoids us from bringing RL clothing into Remesher.
BUT we don't want to export, simply send it to iClone!
And that's what the advertising told us we would be able to do...
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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@Kellytoons
And the DRM has nothing to do with LOD Avatars.
Your have not right
look this picture - it's clear for you
@sonic 7
To correct or clarify something:
1. Of course, I am cloning CC 3 avatars with RL clothing (also re-designed or based on CC-based clothing -EssentialPack - AssassinsPack etc) or purchased RL clothing,
with RL - hair also WITHOUT existing EXPORT LICENSE from CC 3 (pipeline) to IClone 7 send (applies to clothing, hair, accessories, etc)
2. I can also send these avatars as reduced "Game Base" avatars of CC 3 (pipeline) to IClone 7 without the presence of any export licenses (applies to clothing, hair, accessories, etc.)
This works because both avatars are of type iAvatar
What does not work:
I can of CC 3 pipeline (it affects only the pipeline version because only this has the InstallLOD function) CC 3 avatars I have equipped with RL clothing, RL hair, RL accessories, with the "InstallLOD" Remesher Function in one Export fbx file.
Since no "iAvatar" can be created here, but only one fbx file,
as well as fbx files for Unity, UE 4, 3dmax etc. is the export license
clothing, hair, etc. required. These fbx files can be imported without the presence of 3dx in the previously mentioned programs. In order to be able to create an iAvatar as an IClone user from the fbx file, I absolutely need 3dx as well as the export license, even though the converted avatar remains within the RL world.
Greets Postfrosch
PS:
Sonic7, and if you have CC 3 pipeline, then you can try it yourself
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Again, this is a language issue -- we are talking iAVATARS -- NOT FBX. Of course FBX doesn't work with DRMs.
But you (and the other person) were yelling that the LOD for iAvatar isn't implemented, and what I said (apparently not with any understanding on your part) is that it has NOTHING to do with DRM. Let me see if I can make this any clearer -- IF the LOD DID work for avatars, then it wouldn't matter if it had DRM on it or not, because (just like we can do now) you don't need it to go to iClone. And as I keep saying, LOD really doesn't bring any benefit to avatars (again TO iCLONE).
Now -- if you are complaining the CURRENT LOD has DRM problems -- yes, I agree. But that's not what was brought up here, what was brought up here was that folks were upset that LOD hadn't yet been implemented for avatars (and I keep saying you don't need or want it -- it offers very little advantage over what you already have).
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By gordryd - 5 Years Ago
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I'm not at my iClone PC now, and I haven't tried this for awhile, but I had similar problems to the "yellers". Trying to reduce file size/polygons/whatever through LOD, game char, etc. and then import into iClone doesn't work UNLESS you own the export version of the character and everything on the character. This is not right if you are staying within the RL universe. So as you stated, I think it is more of a DRM issue than an LOD issue. Either way, it needs to be fixed.
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Yes, you are right, if that happens.
I'll check (I almost never use RL content anymore since I got CC3 Pipeline but I'll try a reduction on some content I own -- don't own the export license on anything so I should get the error no matter what I try. I wonder if it has something to do with the polygon reduction?).
Edit: LOL -- I couldn't USE Polygon reduction on anything I have that RL sells, at least the 10 or so things I just tried, because apparently they are already so efficient it just gives me that "we can't reduce further" warning. Turning the avatar to game base and then exporting to iClone works just fine, though.
So if anyone has some clothing they can't get over they will have to let me know to try (I'm not going to go through the hundreds I own just trying to find something to reduce. Clearly, though, exporting to iClone works just fine for the base even with DRM clothing on it).
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Ah, okay, FINALLY found something I could reduce. And, as I suspected (sorry to rub it in) it works just fine -- you can use the Polygon reduction and still send to iClone just fine.
So I don't think the complainers here are speaking correctly. There isn't any issue getting reduced Polys over to iClone. I think they are talking about an entirely different thing, making FBX exports. That's something that they SHOULD have the export license for since clearly you can use that stuff outside the iClone universe. But for keeping it inside of iClone there isn't any problem.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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Whatever the terminology, I too was under the impression that the Pipeline would have the benefit of reduced polygon characters for iClone.
Not just a little bit, but seriously, which is what InstaLOD was supposed to do. It should not require export licenses of any kind when staying within the iClone/CC universe. I have spent a lot of money on iClone/CC content, so I am also an interested party.
The problem has been acknowledged by RL in the past, as I recall, but has sort of been brushed aside as export to game engines has had the priority.
I will not "yell", but I sympathize with those who feel slighted.
Also, if the are problems with LOD characters then they should be fixed.
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By jasonjbrown - 5 Years Ago
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OMG I JUST EXPERIENCED THIS LOD ISSUE TEN MINUTES AGO! I was suprised that I could not reduce the polygons of an iClone character and put it back into an iClone scene.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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jasonjbrown (2/15/2019)
OMG I JUST EXPERIENCED THIS LOD ISSUE TEN MINUTES AGO! I was suprised that I could not reduce the polygons of an iClone character and put it back into an iClone scene.
So you expected to be able to do that, correct?
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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But you can.
For each clothing item, go to the modify panel and under LOD choose Polygon reduction. Then for the avatar choose Convert to Game Character. Then send to iClone. Works fine.
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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I just now tried Mike's method here - but do you have any 'control' over the polycount when doing it this way? ie: my clothed avatar ended up being 27,974 polys and I'd only allocated 2,000 polys (total) for ALL the clothes (Mike's method). So how do we get 5k poly clothed actors? (ie: background 'extras')
Using LOD you can get your 5K avatars - but using LOD also forces you to 'export' - meaning that you have to use clothes, hair & accessories that are 'export enabled' and which cost more, even though you're only making a video. (and not exporting at all).
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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You can specify the poly count for each item of clothing but, honestly, having used LOD at the low levels you are talking about -- they aren't background characters (unless your idea of "background" is like a football field away). Anything within 100-200 virtual feet will look ridiculous at those low a level.
And you don't need them that low. I can get literally hundreds of characters in without taking up more than 3GB, which ought to be something even those of you with an 8GB GPU should be able to handle (with your other stuff in the scene). Don't worry about the poly count -- I routinely have millions (and approaching billions) of polys with no issues at all inside of iClone. It's all about the RAM.
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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@Mike ".... I routinely have millions (and approaching billions) of polys with no issues at all inside of iClone. It's all about the RAM ... "
Well I guess that will make you a "billionaire" polygon wise - lol. I think I can only hope to be a millionaire with my budget - anyways - well you're probably right - I hope so, otherwise I'll have a lot characters that won't be wearing much in the background. Even I have a *limited* budget ...
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By jasonjbrown - 5 Years Ago
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I totally expected to be able to create a character, layer on the clothing, reduce the polygon count, and then import it into an iClone scene.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Mike,
you write the same thing over and over again.
It is true that the polygon reduction works in the InstallLOD.
Also DRM is of course no restriction
Nobody denies that, because I do it (almost) every day.
I can send these CC 3 avatars (also called Game Base) as an iAvatar to IClone 7 without any problem.
It's not about the Polyreduktionsmodul but the Remeshermodul in InstallLOD.
I can not use it who I use RL clothing for which I have NO export license. For avatars with clothes imported from DAZ, this module works flawlessly. I can create avatars with 5000 polygons and send them via fbx to IClone.
I made a short video about it. Look at it. Maybe the pictures will tell you more.
I also do not want these avatars close by but create a mass in which the single avatar does not stand out.
No more and no less.
Greets from Germany
Postfrosch
PS
Incidentally, all the CC 3 Pipeline can do that for themselves:
- take a CC avatar
- Attracts RL clothing (or hair or accessories) for which you have no export license
- opens InstallLOD
- and tries to use the function "Remesher"
and this function will not be performed because of DRM.
It may not be that I am using this feature
Export licenses need if I just want to send a LOD avatar via fbx I want to send from CC 3 to IClone. It should be possible in the Remesher module to select "iAvatar" as the export destination.
For Unity, Ue 4, 3dMax, Blender and Co yes, yes the possibility.
Here is also the export license understandable that the avatar leaves the RL world.
The function "Poly reduction" of the Mike speaks is not meant. This works flawlessly. Here I can also generate iAvatare which I can send to IClone.
By the way, not everyone here has a Titan X or 1080ti
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Remesher does create characters you can use as VERY far away folks -- that's about all it's good for. But it's not the LOD Avatars that others were talking about here and you are confusing the two.
Just make sure people understand you want to make crowds of people so far away you'd actually be better off using particles (like Popcorn FX) for.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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But it's not the LOD Avatars that others were talking about here and you are confusing the
Sorry,
I am one of the two (Postfrosch and Toystorylab). And we are talking about these LODs.
Always and from nothing else. So I can not confuse myself.
I can not say what sonic means. And nothing else wrote about it.
Greets from Germany
Post frog
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Sigh -- but you ARE (because that's what's on the roadmap).
Sorry -- I'm out of this thread (I think the language just defeats us from understanding).
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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I think Postfrosch makes a lot of sense when he says " ... It should be possible in the Remesher module to select "iAvatar" as the export destination. ... "
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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And again, this is what i wrote:
toystorylab (2/15/2019)
As Postfrosch states: we WANT, as advertised, to be able to use "Remesher" from instaLOD to create crowds FOR iCLONE with RL Clothes.
For the moment we only can do that with clothes from DAZ/other import/no DRM export licence...
So, once again, RL PLEASE let us know WHEN this will be available!
I have no clue why Mike states it is not clear what we want; we want to use remesher with RL clothes...
I already use remesher with DAZ content (no DRM). Here characters 5084 polys:
The german soldier in front left with gun is the same 5084 poly character, the gun itself has more polys as the soldier...
It is ok when for Mike remesher is useless for that purpose, but for me it isn't. Period.
And especially in the case of Postfrosch, he worked very hard on a huge collection medieval clothing.
But these are all based upon RL clothes. So, without export licence, he can NOT use remesher
to get a crowd of 5000 poly characters for his project of the "thirty years war" (1618-1648)...
And RL advertised this would be possible. Period.
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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we WANT, as advertised, to be able to use "Remesher" from instaLOD to create crowds FOR iCLONE with RL Clothes
Just my 2 cents. Where did they said that Install LOD will be implemented for crowd ? :ermm:
LOD are not for crowd. LOD means Level Of Details , it's a technic to manage resolution relative to a distant camera. The number of low meshes
generated are "embeded" with your Hirez character and that what Install LOD is for.
ICLONE can't (yet) deal with LOD , only threes and plant in Iclone can. The Install LOD were advertise only for game export (maybe I'm wrong) wich suppose you
MUST buy Export liscence for every items you buy.
Now Install LOD could be use to generate a low poly character alone , not embeded with a hirez one, for crowd. But you need an export liscence because you must go outside of
Iclone univers.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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I think we all understand what LOD means, and we do not expect the LOD for a specific character to change dynamically in an iClone scene.
However, for each LOD level there is a version of the character with reduced polygon count. It is these characters that we want to be able to use within iClone. It's as simple as that.
It is not a language problem because I understand English perfectly well and so does Jason Brown. We had an expectation about being able to use reduced poly CC characters in iClone, which somehow doesn't seem to come to fruition.
I also rather have an official response from RL of what expect at this point, as the rest is just speculation. If you don't need the feature fine, but some of us do.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Now Install LOD could be use to generate a low poly character alone , not embeded with a hirez one, for crowd. But you need an export liscence because you must go outside of
Iclone univers.
Either you do not want to understand it,
or you can not understand it !!!
I do not want the polyreduced LOD avatars in any way
of these games Engienes like Unity, UE 4 etc use.
I do not want to use them in the usual way as well
LOD's are used.
I just want to create LOW-Polyge Avater to be able to create Crowdscenen - It works so synonymous - just not RL clothing because this export license is needed. Is also understandable for the export to Unity and Co.
However, I only want to use these lowpoly avatars with IClone - alsop nichut outside the RL world. I would like to send this part of CC 3pipeline (RL) program to IClone 7 (RL program) - without export license. And that does not work !!!!
Before I bought pipleine with CC 3 I asked several times if I could use these LOD avatars in IClone.
I usually got no answer, then it was said, you can use it in IClone because it would be iAvatare !!! But they are not.
Later it was announced that it would work to be able to export these LODs as iAvatars to IClone (possibly announced for CC 3.04 or at the latest for CC 3.1 (sounded as if CC 3.1 were already at the door) in the 2019 Roadmap But nowhere else, unfortunately
Greets Postfrosch
I will not comment on that anymore.
There is no point in discussing it.
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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If you don't need the feature fine, but some of us do
Of course I need that ! I was certainly on of the first to try make one , with success, with CC1 but of course with blender ;)
@ Postfrosh
Sorry If I didn't understand you but I never think that Install LOD was made for Iclone but if you refer to this video at 3:30 :
I understand that it caused frustation because it's clearly Iclone interface with all lowrez with clothes from marketplace .
But instead of your non answer , I had answer but months after buying with the popcorfx that marketplace is forbidden for custummers to sell particles...
Today I will wait weeks after release and I will not engage in pre-purchase anymore.
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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@Job " .... I think we all understand what LOD means, and we do not expect the LOD for a specific character to change dynamically in an iClone scene.
However, for each LOD level there is a version of the character with reduced polygon count. It is these characters that we want to be able to use within iClone. It's as simple as that. .... "
Yes, that clarifies things exactly ....
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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@mtakerkart
But instead of your non answer , I had answer but months after buying with the popcorfx that marketplace is forbidden for custummers to sell particles...
Today I will wait weeks after release and I will not engage in pre-purchase anymore.
Hello, if you mean me:
What do I have to do with Popcorn FX? There is nothing in the whole tread I do not have it anymore. I'm happy with it - even if there are no updates for it. And above all: This has nothing to do with the CC
This is only about the LOD or polyreduced avatar which are not possible with RL clothing via LODInstall without export license.:ermm:
Maybe one should have pointed out in advertising:
Attention: LODInstall only partially suitable for use with IClone. The export license is required for export with RL Cloth..;)
From my side, the matter is resolved
Although I am not satisfied - I was just too stupid to understand the CC 3 pipeline was mainly intended for Unity and Co User. I will not comment on it, as it makes no sense.
Sorry - but I'm disappointed that IClone users depend so easily:angry::(:crying:
Greeting Postfrosch
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By Peter (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Postfrosch (2/16/2019)
Before I bought pipleine with CC 3 I asked several times if I could use these LOD avatars in IClone.
I usually got no answer, then it was said, you can use it in IClone because it would be iAvatare !!! But they are not.
Later it was announced that it would work to be able to export these LODs as iAvatars to IClone (possibly announced for CC 3.04 or at the latest for CC 3.1 (sounded as if CC 3.1 were already at the door) in the 2019 Roadmap But nowhere else, unfortunately
Greets Postfrosch
I will not comment on that anymore.
There is no point in discussing it.
Hi Postfrosch
If you look back to my original reply to you HERE you will see I mentioned that the plan was to add this feature somewhere between the 3.04 and 3.1updates. At the present time, this is still the plan if solutions to some issues can be found (but it isn't confirmed as yet). Sadly though the 3.1 update is not likely to appear before Q3 2019 so it is still some way off sadly.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Peter,
Thanks for your answer
Yes that was your answer
CC3 to iClone: The plan is to fix the issue by implementing direct export of LOD characters from the 3.04 update.
I had relied on.
Unfortunately, none of these dates seems to be fixed after the fact and I have to fear that an export of polyreduced CC 3 avatars (RL-clause without export license) with LODInstall-Remesher to IClone 7 !! may never be possible. There is also no talk of it in the roadmap
For me, the topic is ticked off. I can not (currently ???) no CC 3 avatars with RL-clause for which I have no export license with the LODInstall - Remesher not edit (the remesher does not even open) and so polyreduzieren, although these avatars are sent only to IClone 7 should. This works only with clothes from DAZ (which I do not particularly like) or self-made clothes (which I can not). I will not comment on that because it makes no sense or anything. Pity
Then it should be just like that and I have paid apprenticeship for my good faith.
To make it clear:
I am very satisfied with what CC 3 can do.
The avatars are good to very good.
The Appearance Editor, which does not exist for CC 3 Base avatars, does not work for me because I can dodge CC 1/2 avatars.
Also that one polyreduce clothes now is well solved.
I just miss the opportunity to polyreduce my created avatars so far, so I can do Crowdscenen.
This possibility was the main reason that I bought with the pipline version. (no interest in GoZ, no interest in export to Unity and Co, no interest in IRay)
Greetings from Germany
Postfrosch
I know that you have a very thankless job
by discomfort that is not there for most
to answer. I do not want to make your work unnecessarily difficult.
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By Rampa - 5 Years Ago
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If you delete the teeth of your background characters, they use a bit less resources.
Also, with iC7.41, you can Cntrl-drag to duplicate characters. They will share the same textures, just like duplicated props.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Rampa
I know and use the new function of copying avatars in IClone 7.41 and was very pleased that we finally made it possible. This function has been requested by many users for a long time (IClone 4/5) and reported to RL.
All the more I miss now the possibility to use my own avatars polyredziert. Game Base is a good start, but less than 20,000 polys incl clothes I have not yet found ways. With LODInstall remesher make 5,000 polygons incl clothes. I can reduce avatars with clothes from DAZ or other sources and use them in IClone. But I do not want to pay export license for RL-clothing which I use only within the RL world to make it with self-designed RL-clothing too.
These are avatars of this kind that I want to use.
The clothing was created on the basis of the Accassinen and Wizzard Bases.
Thats ar all Game Bases
greeting from Germany
Postfrosch
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By sonic7 - 5 Years Ago
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Postfrosch " .... Game Base is a good start, but less than 20,000 polys incl clothes I have not yet found ways. With LODInstall remesher make 5,000 polygons incl clothes. I can reduce avatars with clothes from DAZ or other sources and use them in IClone. But I do not want to pay export license for RL-clothing which I use only within the RL world to make it with self-designed RL-clothing too. .... "
Yes - agree .........
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By Raq'm - 5 Years Ago
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I've spent too much money with RL already. If I buy the software I shouldn't have to keep purchasing every additional plugin,tweak, and upgrade you come out with. Its like you just throw "Pipeline" at the end of everything; add two more features, and now everyone has to spend an extra $150 to upgrade in order to take advantage. That's not fair.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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Developers have to eat...:P
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By Polaraul - 5 Years Ago
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Raq'm (2/24/2019)
I've spent too much money with RL already. If I buy the software I shouldn't have to keep purchasing every additional plugin,tweak, and upgrade you come out with. Its like you just throw "Pipeline" at the end of everything; add two more features, and now everyone has to spend an extra $150 to upgrade in order to take advantage. That's not fair.
My feelings are very much the same. The CC3 "Pipeline" edition feels far from a complete solution. If I want to export any morph other than those predefined by CC3, I need iClone. If I need to import DAZ poses, I need 3DXchange. It is also disappointing that the Appearance Editor for the CC3 avatar appear till the end of this year, with no guarantee that it will not now be a paid add on.
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi everyone,
We'd like to correct our misleading information about "LOD iAvatar Export" function.
The function we will deliver in the next patch is not LOD iAvatar Export, but "Remeshed iAvatar Export".
This function will appear on Export > iAvatar. 
You will be able to set up the level of remesher when exporting iAvatar.
Please be noted that this function is still under development, the UI may be changed afterward.
If there is further questions, feel free to let us know. :)
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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is not LOD iAvatar Export, but "Remeshed iAvatar Export".
That would be enough (at least for me).
I also want to polyreduce only CC 3 avatars with my RL-Kleidung (without export license) and export as iAvatar of CC 3 to IClone. With that, I could achieve my goal of creating crowd scenes. I think that too Toystorylab will see it this way. The LOD function is not important to me.
Thanks for the message - Mal shen wan the patch will be released
Greetings from Germany
Postfrosch
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By Mythcons - 5 Years Ago
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I am so excited about the JCM system. I can't wait. This is largely what has kept me from creating products, the lack of such a system. Soon there will be no limits.
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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animagic (2/24/2019)
Developers have to eat...:P
Very true, I demand everyone complaining give out 3-free items of their own creation to the forum first before complaining.
ie - post a tutorial on accomplishments with your workflow, create a script or prop that can be used by the community....
Or, gift cards of any type....(ie Visa gift cards)
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By Dicev - 5 Years Ago
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Looks like some interesting features coming. I especially like the idea of custom Unity HDRP skin and hair shaders. Could you share some sneak peek images what to expect in Unity?
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Dicev (3/13/2019)
Looks like some interesting features coming. I especially like the idea of custom Unity HDRP skin and hair shaders. Could you share some sneak peek images what to expect in Unity?
Hello Dicev,
I have no images on hand. It's a bit delay here, but the script will be launched on Monday (March 18th) or Tuesday (March 19th). You can test it out then. :)
By the way, the main update in this version is for skin.
Skin material will be supplemented with a Detail Map along with proper subsurface scattering (SSS) settings. (For HDRP Rendering Pipeline only)
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Before & After effects. Look details on skin & ear. :)
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By davidaranzabal - 5 Years Ago
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Is this already finished?
- Unity & Unreal: Export of LODs are all embedded into one FBX file. Therefore, only one skeleton is needed to control all of the LOD meshes simultaneously within the engine.
Thanks
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By davidaranzabal - 5 Years Ago
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davidaranzabal (3/27/2019)
Is this already finished? - Unity & Unreal: Export of LODs are all embedded into one FBX file. Therefore, only one skeleton is needed to control all of the LOD meshes simultaneously within the engine.
Thanks
Interested in export to Unity, just in case...
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi davidaranzabal,
Not yet, it's in the development phase. Just to share something behind the scene to you. :)
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By Hookflash - 5 Years Ago
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Will JCM support allow us to import JCMs from Daz (via the Transformer)?
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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RL - it looks like users exporting CC3 characters out would overall like to see a HD poly mesh variant, so that there is no need to rely on the subdivision of outside applications.
This would go beyond JCM for certain areas of the body, and be more along the lines of a preservation of any enacted subD applied to a character once in CC3, or perhaps a HD poly base that could be selected from the point of avatar creation / Transformer-import.
Please consider an entire HD level mesh base which would export 'smooth'.
I can name 2 applications myself that would benefit greatly from such a HD CC3 variant - Unreal and Octane Render.
Again, not just JCM, but a exportable HD smoothness for the shoulders, breast, and any other curve areas that get jagged due to low-poly.
THX
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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after see again this:
i would like to know if could be possible to enable a option to export the "layers" separated from the main skin.
for better customization inside a engine, instead of export a single texture with all the changes from the layers, we can get each mask sepparated on it's own details texture, this help a lot to enable customization in game.
means instead of do all the make up and details inside the cc3 could be good to have a option where you can export like the lipstick mask then with that mask i can add inside the unreal a option to add that mask like the CC3 does.
Basically a option to instead of customize the character inside the CC you export all the layers to do that inside the engine, it can be a big improviment for sure.
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Ellessarr,
Thanks for your suggestion. Our mission is to export / render 3D characters to meet different needs in animation, game, visualization, etc.
While exporting character-related components for character customization in 3rd party tool is not what we aim for.
Ellessarr (5/4/2019)
after see again this: i would like to know if could be possible to enable a option to export the "layers" separated from the main skin. for better customization inside a engine, instead of export a single texture with all the changes from the layers, we can get each mask sepparated on it's own details texture, this help a lot to enable customization in game. means instead of do all the make up and details inside the cc3 could be good to have a option where you can export like the lipstick mask then with that mask i can add inside the unreal a option to add that mask like the CC3 does. Basically a option to instead of customize the character inside the CC you export all the layers to do that inside the engine, it can be a big improviment for sure.
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hookflash (4/12/2019)
Will JCM support allow us to import JCMs from Daz (via the Transformer)?
Hi Hookflash, we don't have the plan so far.
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda (RL) (5/6/2019)
Hi Ellessarr,
Thanks for your suggestion. Our mission is to export / render 3D characters to meet different needs in animation, game, visualization, etc.
While exporting character-related components for character customization in 3rd party tool is not what we aim for.
hmm ok, i told that because it could be the primary way to be used, but it also can work for animtions and others things, because the user could make his own settings inside the unreal too and be able to add others details as VFXs and others thing through this, it's not just for character customization, being able to proper export all details in separated layers can be a big improviment for many things because it allow the user to have more freedom to work outside the CC3 and sometimes achieve better results than what he could get using only CC3 regular way, because he will have a better control over it and sometimes it can be much more fast work direct inside the engine than in CC3.
Unreal engine have very powerfull configurations for materials which if the user is proper allowed to have acess to all needed map textures, he can do amazing things with it in a very fast way, this is why it could also be good for the others options aswell (render, animations and all others), being able to use masks and alpha allow the user to do whatever they want with the model in a very fun and fast way and maybe even more complex than using only CC3.
Also it can save a lot of time for the user, because if he want do any change he don't need go back to CC3 to edit the texture then go back to unreal, in many cases it can be done direct in unreal by having all texture maps and channels being usable, in some cases can be good to have the alpha channel direct inside the main texture, because targa allow you to carry the alpha if you use the 32bit max capacity, then for some cases you can use the main texture to make masks, when you don't need a very complex customization, but the point is having acess to that things can allow the user do really amazing things not only for gaming but rendering and animations.
IT could really attract more peoples to get interested to work with CC3 in they projects, the more options you can give the more attractive, powerfull, complete and desirable to be used as a standart in the market.
well it's a suggestion, if can't be done or developers thinks which it is not something they want do with CC3 ok fine, it's they choices at the end.
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By kungphu - 5 Years Ago
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Great points Ellessar. I really like that line of thinking!
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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kungphu (5/6/2019)
Great points Ellessar. I really like that line of thinking!
thanks, it's really i'm wanting see things improving and that is one a hell good way, because indeed many of the "magics" in the engine are done throught mask and being able to have acess to the proper materials for it could provide the users which a large way to improve and do they own configurations inside the unreal, you can really do a lot of things which you could be limited by only using CC.
if they could add that and the morph targets import in the tool, it could be the nail in the box for me to get full inside and ignore all the money i could had wasted in DAZ, because it could put it above daz(maybe still having the "hair issues", but overal it could make a huge improviment for the tool to make a lot of peoples jump here and buy it almost automatically.
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By Waterlane Studios - 5 Years Ago
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Really interested to see how the new face animation works - 'apology if it's been said but I'm wondering if there will be updates for close up eye animation as well - i.e. this type of thing - where the skin and lid around the eye also deform/morph, related to eye gaze?
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By Waterlane Studios - 5 Years Ago
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double posted - sorry
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By Ellessarr - 5 Years Ago
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here a exemple of how it can be worked inside unreal:
this is the most basic to show how could be good to have the layers being imported in different textures or at last alphas:
 ]
this is the most basic use for this system as you see with that i can change the hair color for any color i want without need go back to CC3 and even can add my own effects on the body hair just using the alpha mask, this give the user a powerfull tool and could make CC3 really a lot attractive not only for game but also animation and render cuz you can have freedom to do a lot of things you could not do in the past, that for sure could be very usefull.
this allow me to add that body hair to any type of skin without have to add it direct in into the skin and have total freedom to customize color and effect over it and if i want a different type of body hair i just have to add a different alpha texture type of body hair all that to work in anyway, if is to game make, to render or to animate, it can be used to any sort of work in a very user friendly way.
I almost guarant which if RL team would add that feature and a base model with more poly count(it's already in work i know) and morph targets aside all others features your team are planning it could automatically already put CC3 above almost all the others products with the same function, AKA daz, CC fuse and others.
A layer system could open a lot of doors for many creative teams to do many things like dirt and thorn cloths and skin and many others things in a much more easy and customer friendly way to work.
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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RL - DISPLACEMENT
Playing with other engines I find one area of deficiency for character modeling in CC3/iClone is that they are missing an independent displacement map from that of Bump/Normal.
While Bump/Normal is changeable via the texture image when used with displacement, if you set the Displacement slider to "0", Bump/Normal, which is connected, also gets set to "0".
This makes it impossible to apply small amounts of displacement while having a good-level of Bump/Normal, thus eliminating displacement as a tool for smaller-finer detail.
I realize overhauling the current channels to add new modes requires a redesign, but want to put this in as idea for the later iterations, ie iC8 and CC4.
THX!
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By reptilebeats - 5 Years Ago
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Hi does anyone know how to combine the materials but continue to use the mesh in character creator?
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By aftamat4ik - 5 Years Ago
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yes. i support ihis idea because it's a lot easier to have 1 character material that can be improved by changig it's parameters instead of having 10 materials. Exporting 10 different characters with different macups and hairs, alphas, skin colors is a real Mess. Please, Reallusion, you should add this feature!
and i still wait when cc3 Apperance Editor will start to work.
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By raxel_67 - 5 Years Ago
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Now that it was mentioned, any news on the AE?
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By Polaraul - 5 Years Ago
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Any news at all would be good, the product just feels a little in limbo at the moment. There are a number of deficiencies in CC3 at the moment, in particular the inability to export morphs. It would be great to feel that some progress is being made on these.
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hello everyone!
We shall be able to show you some work in progress next month. :D
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By AlbertDup - 5 Years Ago
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Hi any news on the Unreal iClone Live Link? It will literally save me hours every day with the project we are working on at the moment. It takes currently over an hour to import the FBX into Unreal with animation from iClone that was motion captured per take per character. Feedback on the IK driven motion capture would also be great.
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By Tony (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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AlbertDup (7/5/2019)
Hi any news on the Unreal iClone Live Link? It will literally save me hours every day with the project we are working on at the moment. It takes currently over an hour to import the FBX into Unreal with animation from iClone that was motion captured per take per character. Feedback on the IK driven motion capture would also be great.
Hi Albert,
Unreal Link Link Plug-in for iClone will be released in late July or early August.
I sent you a private message for the Showcase Collection Program (a chance to get the software earlier and for free)
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By wreeky - 5 Years Ago
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Live Link will be a major time saver for me as well. Currently, for every panel of my graphic novel, IF the scene is compact enough that I can pull it off in iClone, I do. Most of chapter 1 is iClone.
However, I'm finding building scenes with 100s of assets or large landscapes in Unreal to be much easier. The only drawback is creating poses in iClone and importing those into Unreal take so much time it ruins any creative flow. Yes you can tweak poses in Unreal and save poses, etc. But posing characters seems so much intuitive in iClone. Especially faces.
Being able to live pose characters and screen shot panels from Unreal will improve my workflow considerably.
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By Waterlane Studios - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda (RL) (6/24/2019)
Hello everyone!
We shall be able to show you some work in progress next month. :D
any news on the horizon..? :-)
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hello, how did you know that I am going to post something on Friday. :P
Waterlane Studios (7/24/2019)
Miranda (RL) (6/24/2019)
Hello everyone!
We shall be able to show you some work in progress next month. :Dany news on the horizon..? :-)
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By Mythcons - 5 Years Ago
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Very much looking forward to an update on JCMs. :) It's going to be a game-changer.
I'm hoping the system will also allow for morph-linking, so that a single dial can slide several morph values simultaneously (a CTRL dial).
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By Waterlane Studios - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda (RL) (7/25/2019)
Hello, how did you know that I am going to post something on Friday. :P Waterlane Studios (7/24/2019)
Miranda (RL) (6/24/2019)
Hello everyone!
We shall be able to show you some work in progress next month. :Dany news on the horizon..? :-)
... :-)
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Ah, but perhaps "Friday" has slipped to "Monday" (perfectly all right -- better later, good, than sooner, not done :>).
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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haha Mike knows me!
I still want to keep my promise, here you go!
This is the conversion result of the face creation plug-in. Import a photo without doing further settings.
I will show you how it works on Monday. :P
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By Jfrog - 5 Years Ago
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This is the conversion result of the face creation plug-in. Import a photo without doing further settings.
The result is pretty close!
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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Wow, that's amazing!
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By Kelleytoons - 5 Years Ago
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Seeing this is impressive BUT (I always hate to be the pessimist in the group...)
If you don't know the particulars on how this was achieved I wouldn't get TOO excited. Not just yet. Let's see, for example, what the profile or even 3/4 face looks like. As it stands it only looks to me like a nice billboard effect. The proof is in what happens as the face is turned around.
Also -- I'm guessing this is one of those *extremely* hi-def images generated by that process they were talking about here. Sorry not to be more specific, but my gut tells me that we won't really know anything until we see what it can do with a "normal" image that most of us could capture or get from the web. I've used at least three current "state of the art" facial generation systems and the results they give vary from as good as this to totally unusable depending on the source image. I'd want to know if the lighting isn't even, or the resolution isn't, say, super HD whether we could still get nice results.
Finally, I also want to know how easy this is. Miranda says "Import a photo without further settings" -- does that mean it recognizes the features and you don't have to "set" anything? If so, that's both incredibly impressive as well as a little worrisome. That tells me the restrictions on the base image may be, well, restrictive (no open mouth, for example, no using only one side of the face to generate a good one, the face being perfectly centered and rotated, etc. etc.). Again, I'd want to see some Real World examples (most of us who want this want to use celebrity photos where we have little, if any, ability to control such factors).
But -- don't want to be a wet blanket. Even if this is only half as good as it looks it will be a welcome feature for many who do not have access to all the other programs that I've used (even including CrazyTalk 8). So good on RL for making it available inside of iClone.
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By Jfrog - 5 Years Ago
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As it stands it only looks to me like a nice billboard effect. The proof is in what happens as the face is turned around.
I agree that an animated talking face sample would be mostly welcome. :)
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda, will that be compatible as a texture set with later upcoming HD Skin Generator features (makeup, aging, imperfections, etc)?
Thanks!
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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Miranda, will that be compatible as a texture set with later upcoming HD Skin Generator features (makeup, aging, imperfections, etc)?
Thanks!
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By Mythcons - 5 Years Ago
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The photo-to-3D-Face technology looks pretty impressive. It looks like it can serve as both a quick way for customers to generate a face, and as a starting point for professionals to touch up with further texturing and sculpting.
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By Mythcons - 5 Years Ago
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Kelleytoons (7/27/2019)
Seeing this is impressive BUT (I always hate to be the pessimist in the group...)
If you don't know the particulars on how this was achieved I wouldn't get TOO excited. Not just yet. Let's see, for example, what the profile or even 3/4 face looks like. As it stands it only looks to me like a nice billboard effect. The proof is in what happens as the face is turned around.
Also -- I'm guessing this is one of those *extremely* hi-def images generated by that process they were talking about here. Sorry not to be more specific, but my gut tells me that we won't really know anything until we see what it can do with a "normal" image that most of us could capture or get from the web.
I think it goes without saying that hi res images will get you the best results. There's only so much technology can do. I suspect that certain elements would have to be manually adjusted (eyes, teeth placement), similar to the process of CrazyTalk 8. It looks like this is a much improved version.
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By justaviking - 5 Years Ago
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Thank you for sharing that picture, Miranda.
My thoughts are similar to what others have said:
- An impressive result
- I am hopeful
- But my optimism is under control... I've always struggled with the photo-to-face process, especially around the eyelids more than anything else (I lack the knack on that), so if this works for someone like me, that will indeed be very impressive.
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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Love it Miranda!!! As always I'll use it outside of the box ;)
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By Miranda (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hi everyone,
I believe you will find the answer from this post. :)
https://forum.reallusion.com/418339/What-to-Expect-in-the-Second-Half-of-2019
Extra information:
Indeed, the better quality of image will get better results.
The resolution of the elderly's photo is 676 x 1016. I think it's not bad, right?
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By Mythcons - 5 Years Ago
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Wow, that's a pretty low resolution for such amazing results. Good job. :)
The key for me will be what the underlying mesh looks like. I will be happy if it can get details approximately where they need to be on the mesh, so that it can be refined further manually.
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By unit23 - 4 Years Ago
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Rampa (2/6/2019)
Consider how you can use those two features I mentioned together.
Made also a video around this workflow, citing your method https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IB9L9J4p79o
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By TonyDPrime - 4 Years Ago
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Hi Miranda, any more previews we can see from the upcoming shader, or other developments?
:rolleyes:
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By Miranda (RL) - 4 Years Ago
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Hi Tony!
Yes, we will announce 2020 roadmap in February. :)
TonyDPrime (1/21/2020)
Hi Miranda, any more previews we can see from the upcoming shader, or other developments?
:rolleyes:
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By colombiologo10 - 4 Years Ago
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Miranda (RL) (3/18/2019)
Before & After effects. Look details on skin & ear. :)
Excuse me. Will you give support to URP?.
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