After I was asked to do an intro for a freind who expected me to do it in After Effects, instead I used Iclone using the new video montage sets. He asked how I did them so I said Iclone ... then he asked "Whats that" ... Well its a 3D character animation suit I said ..... Ho he said like poser err No not like poser have you seen any machinema I asked ... He said he had but couldn't understand why they didn't just play the game instead of trying to make a film with it .... I said its a bit like that .. He said "?" and pointed at the video id just made and said you crnt do that in Second Life ...

So I said err its complicated....

So what is Iclone:D



I Make My Mates Do The CanCan For The Amusement Of Killer Robots:D

Wow I'm surprised no one's answered this.

Ok.

iClone is something that is SPECIFICALLY MADE for creating REALTIME 3D movies ore movies using realtime 3D effects. That would be the best way to describe it.

The reason you can't do this in Second Life (or any other game [unless of course you have access to the actual engine for scripting]) is because it's a GAME and therefore doesn't have any tools or options especially made for doing thins like this. (e.g. the timeline).

He can say "We could've done that in After Effects. SURE, AE DOES have a FEW more little features (or maybe SLIGHTLY more realistic I guess), but then again, that's NOT realtime and you're waiting for renders.

So in short, iClone is a realtime special effects and 3D graphics software. Is it as good as 3DS or Maya? Not yet, but I feel that it is coming close as you can do a lot of very nice things in it.

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It's the Swiss Army knife of 3D animation. Everything you need to get the task done but nothing that  makes perfection easy :D

Kind regards,

Alex

In another post there was concern that Iclone would not be able to enter a competition for machinema , it occurs to me that if Iclone carries on developing it would not be to long before it stops being a tool for machinema and becomes something different. In my opinion it has already taken a step in this direction with Iclone 4 and the ability to use video, this has opened up an entirely new aspect to Iclone that takes it a step away from machinema and a step nearer to ? 3d max, Poser, just what is the future for Iclone and under what software genre would I find it ?




I Make My Mates Do The CanCan For The Amusement Of Killer Robots:D

The fact that some say it's not a machi tool is simply redicuous. Ok sure, it has a SLIGHT edge because it can use video effects and stuff and it s a LITTLE more complex... but at it's core, it's still a machi tool. It's definatly NO 3DS Max, Maya, or even Blender and the users will tell you as such.

I mean, if people wanna get all picky about machi tools, then MovieStorm isn't a TRUE one either... See the trick USED to be "how close can I get this GAME to look like a movie?" Now it's just... "Oh, we're just using DirectX to make movies... no other purpose" Lionhead's TheMovies would still pass because it's a GAME. You can make machinima with Ape Escape 3 and the monkeys on there (it's for the PlayStation 2) They have a little movie making thing... but it's using the GAME's tech. Both moviestorm and iClone are just... 3D movie makers... so in a sense, NIETHER of them are TRUE machi creators because going by that definition, they're not using any sort of game engine. IT's pretty much just 3D sfotware in realtime with really simple animation tools.

Because if movie storm is one, and iCLone isn't, that means that they're saying "oh it's too complex to be a machi creator because you have too many different ways you can do things. Well that's because people requested to DO MORE THINGS so it happened. Moviestorm might evolve somewhat the same way.

And also if we're going by this, then MachStudio Pro is also a machi tool (very expensive but still) a machi tool because it's ALSO using realtime DirectX graphics... sure it's 4,000 dollars, but it's realtime, 3D graphics JUST LIKE iClone and Moviestorm.

See what I'm saying?

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I did not approach Iclone from a machinema angle, I started in the 1980s with a program called 3d construction kit that allowed you to build 3d worlds and games on the PC and Amiga over the years I moved on to Poser 2 on the Mac then up to Poser 6 , but never got the hang of Poser enough to make a film, it took me long enough to get a character dressed and walking.

So when I met Iclone it felt like what I wanted 3d constructor Kit to be 30 years ago. So when the term Machinema is used it leaves me a bit cold as in my mind it is making films from games. I know this may annoy harden Machinamists (? is that a word) but its just how I feel about the term.

So what would it take for Iclone to no longer be a machinema tool (for competition to exclude it ) and would it be a bad thing if it did move away from Machinema. If Poser and 3dmax and the like became realtime movie making tools would they become machinema ?





I Make My Mates Do The CanCan For The Amusement Of Killer Robots:D

Ah now that's a good question. I mean, you can make mvies with 3DS, Maya, whatever... so those ARE movie making tools but I agree with you in the fact that machi (my short word for machinima) is based off a game engine.

Ok I wrote a bunch of stuff about what I thought and then I actually looked up the word Machinima and here are my results.

# Machinima ( or ) is the use of real-time three-dimensional (3-D) graphics rendering engines to generate computer animation. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machinima

# The rendering of computer-generated imagery using low-end (real time) 3D engines such as those found in video games, as opposed to the high-end ...
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/machinima

# (derived from machine and cinema) is filmmaking created through the real-time recording of computer games, virtual worlds or any already-existing ...
www.twinity.com/en/glossary

# A production technique that can be used to perform digital puppets. Machinima involves creating computer-generated imagery (CGI) using the low-end ...
www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Digital-puppetry

So you can click those links to see the fll ones.

So according to some of these, iCLone IS a machi making tool because it's realtime 3D... however, it's not so... low-end anymore. That's maybe why some don't call it a machi tool... because it's more advanced or more high end, but that doesn't really make sense to me. If I had the power to make movies equal to what's being made in 3DS max in realtime like the big studios do (and they take time to render there too), then I'd LOVE to make movies like that in realtime. iClone allows me to do that... but it's not "low-end..."... OR IS IT? It's not low -end, but I do know that it has a LOT more visual features than movistorm. Some people say it just has a lot of eye candy... but uh... it's for MOVIES and things that you WATCH. What else is it suppose to have? If it were a GAME engine, then you could say that, but really, it has more visual features like I said and that makes it look a bit more high end.

According to some ofthese definitions, none of the specialty machi software (moviestorm or iClone) are true machi creators because it's not using a game engine. ... but they are using premade things... well... iClone 4 actually is about to launch even further when 3D Xchange 3 comes out because then you'll be able to load FBX files which has their own set of bones so nothing will be completly premade anymore.

So in some standards, iClone will always be a machi tool, and in some it won't.When iClone reaches the point where we set something up and we have to wait for it to render it (in nonrealtime) THAT is the true point where it will not be a machi tool anymore.

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I have read your other post about Iclone becoming a game engine in its own right, this is a very interesting and real potability for Iclone. If it did move in this direction then it would be a formidable machinema and gaming tool, but would this be a benefit to Iclone or a hinderance.

If you think that with the computers always developing, allowing us to do more with each generation it isnt unthinkable for Poser and Iclone to be competing in the same arena (both real time rendering with high quality output) who knows maybe one day it may be a real alternative to 3dmax and the like, but would it get there if it takes the game engine rout, or could it take both. I mean there is no reason why Iclones Pixel shader has to be the highes output option, it could have a higher quality output that does not render in quick time and the lower quality could be used creating games.

Also if Iclone went down the Game engine road it would open up the posabilities of interactive content being produced with it .. now that would be interesting...:w00t:



I Make My Mates Do The CanCan For The Amusement Of Killer Robots:D

Indeed, it could have a higher quality that you had to wait for, but then that'd kill the idea of realtime... sure it'd be near realtime because you could still see everything you cannow and then after the post render, it'd just be even better. But then in that case, it'd be like a really nice Blender. (blender has a game engine, but a lot of things can't be rendered in it because it uses only OpenGL)

I konw for a fact that Poser models have a LOT of polygons in them...

The PlayStation 3 is able to render about 1.2 million polygons at a framerate that's a bit over 30. This is because ofthe special CPU it has (the cell processor). Computers don't need that CPU because we now have GFX cards with over a gig ofRAM in them... but not many people have those. I have one with 786 megs of video RAM. The average person now has 512 megs... some still have about 128 megs. I remember when 512 was still a high number and that wasn't too long ago... about a year maybe. So maybe in a few years or near the end of 2010 even, the average person will have a GFX card with 700 megs of RAM but I doubt it. I said all that to say that the idea of 3DS Max andPoser doing things in real time (glibal illumination and stuff like that) isn't quite here yet. I've seen a FEW engines that can do realtime global illumination and direct lighting, but they are far and inbetween. I think that iClone as a game engine wouldn't harm it at all.

For realtime we'd still have to stay with pixel shaders for a while I think but they COULD fix their reflection glitch which has not been fixed in 4.
Another thing they can do is add physics... NOT certain objects that we have to by that have physics in them... but physics in the brogram... or if they are going to sell it, sell a pack with ALL the 3D blocks, just... with physics applied to them.. and not set physics, I mean... if I wanna make it bouncy, I can, if I wanna make it like a giant rock, I can.

And then the LAST thing... wel lnot the last, but last in this list, is to give the characters motion synthesis. To see what I mean, google a software called Endorphin or Euphoria. If THOSE were in iCLone, I'm sure people would just about die... and then revive them selves and die again two more times before using the software.

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I like the physics idea. Ever play with Cararra? It has some pretty nifty physics features...