Rampa, 

As Dennis notes, the webinar was a good example of the thing I was thinking about.  However, your example is interesting.

A person could make a snack.  In and of itself this is a challenging animation exercise... but even more of a challenge to take that, and make it a story.  While it's ALWAYS easier to write about it (I can't tell you how many scripts I've read that do this, "explain" the action as if it were that easy to film and get it across, or let your actors "act" it out -- I tell the folks, yeah, don't explain what is happening if I can't see it) here is one example: We see the woman come in the kitchen.  She looks preoccupied, but starts to make a sandwich.  As she works it's clear her mind is not on the task, but we see her gazing off in the distance as she goes through the motions of taking the bread and spreading, spreading, spreading on it.  Closeup of her face, and sorrow is reflected there, along with a dullness of purpose.  She glances down at the bread in her hand and we see that she's torn it to pieces with her spreading of the peanut butter, so that it no longer is any kind of a sandwich.  She throws it away and as she leaves the kitchen we pan past the counter where we see a telegram with the words "so sorry about your loss" but the rest is not readable as she leaves the frame, out of focus.

Or -- whatever.  Point being that an "animation" can be MUCH more than just that, a powerful means of telling a story through simple actions, camera and timing choices, and "acting" (although in our case the "acting" is either done through keyframing or a combination of such with mocap).

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Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

3D Animated Film/Movie:

All modern (Great) films have a good story.
3D Animation is the skill of "How well you tell the story."
...the story can't tell itself.

I like to practice what rampa was talking about... "Kitchen Scene".
Following a Script... wow... that's takes skill. (To meet deadlines).

Animation is what brings life to any film.
Many scenes tell the story with "No" audio.... just watch the subtle movements of the eyes, camera angles, depth of field, etc.

3D Animation.... is a skill within itself..... to accurately tell any story. (Using iClone)

You'll like this then :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kavxsXhzD48

edit : Since no one want's to click on a link with no title (why no preview in here?) the video is "See with your ears: Spielberg and sound design".  Great little piece.

My YouTube Animations

uncwee :)

"Many scenes tell the story with "No" audio.... just watch the subtle movements of the eyes, camera angles, depth of field, etc."

True that. I have also used a completely black screen to convey a feeling. In the 3rd part of my naval video, one of the ships is destroyed by enemy fire
and the screen goes to black as the commander of that ship falls mortally wounded to the deck. The music carries into the black screen where it, and the 
commander both die.  Sometimes it's not what you hear or even what you see that can carry the message. You also see this in many episodic shows
on TV. Usually where one main character holds a gun on another main (either with or without a gun) and the screen goes black followed by a gunshot.
Who shot who?

I just want to say that this has been the best discussion about,as it turned out, film and animation from the amateur to the professional. Just great. ;)

:cool: pete



http://www.youtube.com/user/peterblood50?feature=mhee

Wow! So many (New) things to remember.
Thanks everyone!:)

I have been reading and enjoying all the discussion here. Very good info. I myself have many stories in my head. I think of a lot of good short stories, like 1 to 2 minute videos, when I walk my dog every morning. Then when I get back home, reality sets in and I have many things to do. The moral of this post is:
A video on the screen is worth 10 stories in the head". :P

I have enrolled in several Udemy courses when they are priced so low you cannot pass them up. So I am deeply involved in getting better. It just takes time. ;)
Carry on,
TS

Mark's both Film-maker & Animator. With his beady eye behind  16mm? film camera lens & fidgety fingers on CGI Animation keyboard.

Interesting, informative & entertaining thread. However, I think apples should be compared with apples, not oranges.

IMO, Film-making is filming the action., Animation is making the action. Putting it very simply.



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The Rashomon Effect

One of my all time favorite themes is summed up in the fantastic movie, "Rashomon" (which, if you haven't yet seen, stop reading right now go out and find it and watch it!).  It examines the nature of truth as four people recount their own version of a story, which reveals that every person has their own viewpoint and perhaps the truth is always somewhere in-between.

Kurosawa was most likely not the first to explore this, but this classic film has certainly inspired hundreds of variations on it.  But as much as I love this (and have used it myself) perhaps the most important takeway is this: EVERYONE IS THE HERO OF THEIR OWN STORY.

It's so significant I want to repeat it: "Everyone is the hero of their own story."  As you live your life, you don't see yourself as a supporting player.  Oh, you may well recognize others accomplishments, you may even understand and appreciate the part others have to play in your life, but you don't see yourself as anything other than the lead.  And so does everyone else.

This is so critical to understand and so often missed by almost every writer: even the baddest bad guy thinks of himself as the "protagonist" (which isn't necessary "good").  And so does the smallest bit player.

If you can write like this, with this understanding, your writing will soar.

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Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

Interesting contributions all round. Thanks, all, I appreciate it.

Coming on to the thread title as Filmmaking versus Animation, I must admit I did not read it in the same way that everyone here seems to have read it.

I know that a large part of the iClone community is involved in using Unity or Unreal game engines to write or add to games. I assumed that ''animation' referred to this activity.

I am glad indeed to see so many that opt for the storytelling in cinematic style. I had no idea that so many were doing this. I thought that the majority were game-builders.

As a pattern for this several contributors have instanced the ninja-type character crossing the bridge in a recent seminar. I thought that this kind of activity - and additionally the same ninja falling into each and every trap - was the kind of animation that would be pieced together in UE4 or some such to form an element in a game.

Home Built in Coolermaster ATX case with GigabyteGA-Z170X-GAMING 7 MoBo, i7-6700 @ 3.4 Ghz, Asus GeForce GTX 1080 Ti GraphicsCard, 32Gb DDR4 RAM, an Acer CB241HQK  & a Samsung S24D300 monitor, Huion H610Pro Graphics Tablet, Kinect v2, Logitech C920 Webcam, Win 10 64 Bit OS

iClone was initially marketed as a Machinima or real-time filmmaking tool, which attracted users such as myself. (RL also claimed it was easy...:unsure: ) The application to games came later (3DXchange contributed to that), so you will find filmmakers (good or bad) among iClone's users. In a way it's good that the user base is so broad, as each have their own requirements that help the product move forward. I'm not a gamer, but I appreciate the technological advances in graphics card quality and speed that come from that segment of users.

There is a tendency of this board to get hung up a bit too much about the technology, so it's nice to see a discussion about filmmaking, animation, and story-telling. 

I think colour pointed out an interesting distinction: with animation you cannot just tell your actors what to do; you have to animate them, which is quite a daunting task when you think of it. Now if you have Mocap, you can alleviate that to some extent, but not everyone has the funds or the space to use that option.

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