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Props and bones --- discoveries and questions

Posted By justaviking 12 Years Ago
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Props and bones --- discoveries and questions

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justaviking
justaviking
Posted 12 Years Ago
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This is an offshoot of my older thread about animating props.

So far, I've learned a lot about:

  • Attaching props and sub-props
  • MERGING attached props into a single prop
  • "Edit Animation Layer" - which can only be done after you do the merge
  • How attaching a prop to a previously scaled parent really messes things up
  • Moving the PIVOT point
  • Being able to do IK animations in a prop I've merged

Here's where I need help.  I feel like I'm so close, but one thing in particular has me stumped:

  • My props seem to have some inherent "center point" that I cannot control
  • Even if I Reset my prop, Reset Transform, and Edit Pivot, I get an unwanted pivot that completely messes up my IK behavior
  • See pictures, below

A couple other things that still perplex me are:

  • Trying to re-structure a prop's hierarchy in 3DXchange
  • Doing IK animation using local coordinates (I think this will be an enhancement request)
  • Why I get an "extra, intermediate phantom prop" in the hierarchy in 3DXchange
  • But more on those later

WHAT WORKS:

I have successfully created a prop that looks like an industrial robot.  I used cylinders, and when you double-click to add a cylinder prop, it has one end at 0,0,0.  I stretched it into a longer cylinder and made my robot.  I can do IK animations and it works great.

When I "Edit Animation Layer," it has bones...

And my IK (Inverse Kinematics) animation works great.

If I move one of the limbs (FK, not IK) to separate them, you can see a previously invisible bone between the limbs.

WHAT DOES NOT WORK:

I tried to make the same robot using rectangles instead of cylinders.  The heart of the problem is that the "center-point" of a cylinder is not at one of the ends.

So I did "EDIT PIVOT" and moved the pivot point to one end.  I did the Reset Transformation and Reset Scale too.

I assembled my robot, and you can see that the rotate gizmo is exactly where I want it to be.

But... that "extra" bone that was initially invisible when I used cylinders is still tied to the ORIGINAL origin of the prop.  You can now see the TWO BONES that make up each limb of my robot.

When I do IK animation, this makes it pivot in the wrong locations.  It somehow remembers the original pivot point, even though I did an Edit Pivot and reset transformation.  (See two pictures earlier).  Here you can see how the limbs pull away from each other, because of where the pivot is located.  (People with sharp eyes will notice my rectangles changed.  I made a mistake, but did not recreate all my screen shots.  That doesn't affect my story.)

SO... WHAT TO DO?

How can I make iClone use the pivot point I want?

In 3DXchange, there is a "Singularize Pivots" that I can't find any documentation on.  I think it does what I need, sort of.  But it's not very convenient, and I don't like randomly clicking on things.

Any and all help will be appreciated.  I've learned a lot (mostly what NOT to do) and will be willing to share my knowledge, limited as it may be.  But this is nearly a show-stopper for me.  Help, please!



iClone 7... Character Creator... Substance Designer/Painter... Blender... Audacity...
Desktop (homebuilt) - Windows 10, Ryzen 9 3900x CPU, GTX 1080 GPU (8GB), 32GB RAM, Asus X570 Pro motherboard, 2TB SSD, terabytes of disk space, dual  monitors.
Laptop - Windows 10, MSI GS63VR STEALTH-252, 16GB RAM, GTX 1060 (6GB), 256GB SSD and 1TB HDD


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Forum Post Props and bones --- discoveries and questions By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post I think a simple question would be: Is there any way to actually... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post Here's one more observation, that may provide an additional clue. When... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post It might be something with the pivot editor and editing the pivots... By Rampa ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post @Rampa, D'oh! You have given me a great workaround. But not a cure.... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post Doh! now I get it, i wasn't sure if you were adding bones somewhere... By planetstardragon ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post @rampa and psd, Thank you for the additional thoughts and... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post Closer, Yay! It might the pivot point mixing that's causing the... By Rampa ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post Does it stretch out the intermediate bones if you only do IK on the... By Rampa ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post [quote][b]rampa (9/8/2013)[/b][hr]Does it stretch out the intermediate... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post It seems you can select for translation either before or after the... By Rampa ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post @rampa, Now if there were a way to move the bone's endpoint (pivot... By justaviking ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post If anyone feels the need, there is an "ignore" feature in the control... By Rampa ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post These discussions always leave me with the impression that somehow in... By animagic ( 12 Years Ago )
Forum Post JUSTAVIKING, I assume by now you've figured this all out. Just... By JC Weatherby ( 11 Years Ago )
Forum Post This is an old thread, but it's really helped me figure out how to... By JC Weatherby ( 11 Years Ago )
Forum Post @JC, I'm glad you were able to extract something helpful from this... By justaviking ( 11 Years Ago )
Forum Post Yeah, that scaling can cause a lot of issues, but there is a fix that... By Rampa ( 11 Years Ago )



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