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Character Creator 4 (node based concept)

Posted By @RettRona 3 Years Ago
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@RettRona
@RettRona
Posted 3 Years Ago
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Hi everyone my name is Garrett. Fist time posting on the forum. So...I have a small background in design and today I started thinking about the idea of CC being a node based software. Generally nodes can simplify complex workloads and allow for expanded API’s for communities to create tools with. I believe CC would definitely be a great choice for this approach. The idea is to have a TEXTURE or MORPH node, and combine with others blending values together. Effector nodes could be implemented to change the output appearance of a texture. Nodes could also be grouped as a DNA stack which can be saved a reused in later projects. Just to get the concept out I spent two hours figuring out what this would look like. ***DISCLAIMER*** I do understand some stuff doesn’t make sense, its just a rough idea. If the community has any ideas to add please share here. If Reallusion wants to give me a job I would gladly flush out this concept lol. Cheers 
https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/db6d22ab-1688-49e1-8de1-ebe.jpeg
mtakerkart
mtakerkart
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If RL implements the node concept , I would be the first to leave Reallusion products.
I've been a user for 12 years because  their tools are the easiest to use. They don't use that abstruse concept of nodes.
As a producer the node-based tools slow the workflow. The nodes were created a long time ago to compensate for the lack of
power of the hardware wich had to manage UI/script too long to process.
@RettRona
@RettRona
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Interesting...🤔 in my experience node based approaches are pretty simple but I do believe it’s hard for some to wrap they’re minds around it. Have you tired Houdini? Maya and blender are also flowing that approach now. Must be a reason why big companies have this offering. While I haven’t been a user of character creator 3 for 12 years, nor knew that it existed for that long lol. The UI of both CC and iclone are very cluttered and could be at least improved for functionality. Or... they could just let the software get more cluttered while it expands with ever growing content and plugins. Or they could just consolidate the plugins into nodes with a inspection stack. Also I would like to bring up the amount of space the current UI takes up. The more you see the character the better, that’s the art piece and easily viewable from any monitor size. Hopefully older users won’t be the ones holding back great technology from being expanded because of complacency. The technologies potential is great even if not node based. Maybe Reallusion has to please they’re older user base but the problem with that is nodbody was making feature films in North America in that group. Previz is cool but I have my sights set on realistic digital humans, stand based hair, dynamic wrinkles, cloth simulation.
mtakerkart
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It is really a personal opinion which is mainly intended for Reallusion. Don't worry about Reallusion's decisions, they will always go to what is most profitable and if the node market is,
they will develop it. Yes I am definitely older than you and used Shake for a year in 2004 (Shake was used for the lord of the ring 1). It was a nightmare to create thing but perfect for speed.
I am first and foremost a director and a producer so the learning curve has to be very fast. I don't have the time and money to learn software and node lists for months,
 having to do the same procedures over and over again when they can be automated.
Nodes are not intended for artists and storytellers in small teams who have very small budgets.
I've never seen a serious movie made by a one man band who used houdini and maya, it's always been a really big crew.
Since Blender came out with the Eevee renderer and nodes (few years ago), there hasn't been any serious production done by a small team either.
I'm talking about feature films or series, for video games it's different.
AutoDidact
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As a Die hard Blender user I am very 
comfortable with node based workflows
However I only use Iclone/CC3 to create animated Characters
to be exported to Blender where I have my complex environments
That I create myself With Blenders node based materials and a few paid Addons.



IMHO CC3 was created to give Iclone users an alternative
to Chasing the endless versions of Daz genesis and  have easy to create  Native high quality Characters for Iclone.



Someone looking to create film quality Characters is likely not 
Using Iclone/CC3 or Daz figures but Maya and Houdini and their node base systems
 




RAG DOLL COLLISION ANIMATIONS FOR ICLONE 8 & 7
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ghost Origins
My latest Feature length film created with Iclone.
https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/adf9b210-df59-4cb6-aa1b-9de5.jpg
My Sci- Fi Graphic Novel on Amazon: https://a.co/d/9k3cwoY


@RettRona
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Understandable! I wouldn’t say nodes would be a replacement for artist tools but more of a extension of the manipulation of morphs and textures. I wouldn’t think this would need to be that deep of a workflow either. Like Unreal, it can be as deep as you want it to be. My proposal is simply a different way of visualizing a complete character (morphs & textures) within a sequence of nodes. I look at it like a DNA stand of what makes a human. Just a concept I’m still enjoying most of what I see from the community.
animagic
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If you look at Skin Gen with its layered approach it would be hard to replicate that elegantly in a node-based system and still maintain some simplicity. I have seen the graphs needed in Blender to recreate the Skin Gen shader and it looks kind of messy.

With Creator Creator, I can create characters very quickly and they are good enough to appear in movies. I have actually had some success with mine in competitions and festivals last year.


https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/436b0ffd-1242-44d6-a876-d631.jpg

4u2ges
4u2ges
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*Smart* nodes and texture handling can be more than just applying to it to skin, or such. I'd say it can come in one way or another as a plugin to virtualize things like smart texture tiling, randomising, which cannot be achieved with traditional UV tiling, nor substance. It should be like an option to enhance material under a single interface, scalable for future updates. So that we would not need a separate, stand alone shaders like SSS. And it should coexist with current, traditional method of creating and applying materials. 






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