Hello, I have a model wearing a Tunic/Toga type of thing and no matter what I try to delete skin weights from the arms they weights just keep coming back and place on other bones, and I keep getting the tunic stretching as the arms are raised. Am I missing something about CC3 skin weight painting where if you remove the weights from one bone they just get moved around to another bone??? I have spent like 8-10 hours on this thing and no matter what I do makes a difference.  Notice the Huge stretching on the tuning as the arms are raised.  I tried, replaced, remove, quick replace with 0 on all the bones, selecting the vertices manually and doing a quick replace of 0--the weights just show up again on the other arm bones and hips. $15 to the first person to help me figure this weirdness with CC3 out! .

https://gyazo.com/7718f848e06b03a8b1645965c3e40eb9

Notice that even if I select the vertices manually and do a Quick Replace 0 for every Bone name in the list, they still are stretched and wonky.  Also, when I tried and do a 0 for the last bone (Clavicle) it still never goes away, but you can see that clearly there is no way that all those selected vertices are not attached to a clavicle and most are black:

https://gyazo.com/c340b801592de79f96677f01fbc4ba0e

Thanks!

I don't really have the time to help you (and in any case don't want your money) but the first thing I would ask is how you are weighting it in the first place.

You really shouldn't have to spend a lot (or any, really) time manually weighting a cloth item.  Either it works with the default skin weight, or it will work better in one of the custom ones (so, maybe try cloak for example).  If it does not, then the problem is undoubtedly poor construction on the item itself, or the need to use cloth physics instead of character weights to get the effect you want.

So my second question would be -- how did you get this item?  If you made it, you may have to redo your construction routines.  If it came from someone else it may just be so poorly made it will never work in iClone. 

Just some thoughts -- good luck.

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Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

I think what he means is: Suppose you have a weighted item and want to remove some weights of parts of that item. After you "remove" those weights if you select the bone again they have some sort of "new" applied weights. 

I do not need your $15 either , but if you just need to completely remove weights, Convert to Accessory. There is button in the object properties panel.
Looks to me it was designed in MD? Anyway it's always hard. You have to decimate and then deform mesh without weights to match a T-pose first and then apply weights.
You can do this in CC, which is very hard, or take it out to Blender or such, which suited better for this type of work.
BTW, if you're completely stuck, I might spare an hour this evening EST PM. If you wish send it to me.

@Mike What happened?? I see rdegoede333 post! Feel Better anyway

Hoi Kelleytoons, how are you, recovering fast? Just wondering ...

Sorry, don't want to hijack thread, but total knee replacement last Tuesday.  Recover is... challenging.  I can sit for around 30 minutes (and my laptop is no longer capable.  Of almost anything.  I've ordered a new one but it won't be here for several weeks, at which point I might not need it <g>  At least for now).

This, too, shall pass.  But I appreciate those of you who care.

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Alienware Aurora R16, Win 11, i9-149000KF, 3.20GHz CPU, 64GB RAM, RTX 4090 (24GB), Samsung 870 Pro 8TB, Gen3 MVNe M-2 SSD, 4TBx2, 39" Alienware Widescreen Monitor
Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

Exactly @facr73!   When I remove the weights it just changes the weights on a different part of the arm, then I remove those as well, and come back to the original part of the arm I removed the weights and now they are back with some other weird weights.

Hi @Kelleytoons, I made this in Marvelous Designer 9.5.  I also made the Robe underneath in MD, and it has the same problems, no matter what built-in weighting applied it gives terrible weights around the arms.  This is with Default, Cloak, Dress, etc.. Is there any reason why CC3 has a "Whack-A-Mole" game where if you change the weighting it keeps spreading it out along a bunch of other bones?  Even if I completely delete all the weights from bones they just keep getting spread around--makes no sense to me.  I guess I'll just bring it into Blender and learn how to do weighting there.  The reason why I didn't bring in the clothes in TPose was because the model I am animating in Unity is going to be in a pose with his hands near his sides and the simulation of the robe was exactly how I wanted it like in MD. If I were to simulate the clothes in MD in T-pose they would droop down and not have the desired look I wanted.

Hi @4u2ges, thanks for the offer to help--I was hoping this would just be a "oh you are doing it wrong, use this brush!" type of thing. Yes, this is in MD, and I needed it formed not in the T-Pose for the designed wrinkles/draping for my character. The character is going to just be talking with their hands outstretched so wanted to get the right look without having to do Alembic (which looks like the best results if I put the time into to sync the character anims to it in Unity).Happy to let you look at it if you think you can spot something easily I am missing   My Discord User is: BenHumphrey#7297, I can send you the CC3 file--thanks!
Here is what I want it to look like (which is how I modeled it in MD:
https://gyazo.com/54394beb51a49c1ebd3cf25dcd8d1382

If I put it in TPose and then apply the Dress weighting (which is the closest best result I've found for this) it looks like this when I put it back to the main pose the character will be in (notice the scrunched shoulder of the tunic and gap on the bottom left):
https://gyazo.com/5d08e3cde4948d89810f8f5387b31feb

Just a thought but,
are the robe and drape two separate clothing items?
If so are they on different layers?

Jeff



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Jeff asked a good question.
As far as I can see the drape is a separate item of cloth and was simulated separately?

I like a T-pose. Bottom part is easy to fix with Mesh Edit.
Shoulder can be fixed a little but not much and it would look better than the one weighted in A-pose.

Now here's something to understand. It almost impossible to tweak the weights of baggy cloth to perfection (regardless A, or T pose)
With bone weights, the vertex can only have statically assigned bone influence. It can not change at animation run time.
This is where Physics comes in handy. Cloth items such as drapes or cloaks, as Mike suggested,
must have Physics map applied to simulate natural movement at some parts, where gravity should take precedence. Bone weight simply cannot compensate that.
Specifically his left shoulder (T-pose weighted) can only be fixed with Physics to look *good*. Applying Physics is also not a walk in the park and I am not even sure if it can be transferred to Unity (I know almost nothing about it).

Anyhow, I do not have a Discord account. If you wish, just pack both versions - a T-pose sim and an A-pose sim from CC and use Dropbox or Google Drive or similar. I try to have a look at it and advise you.

Hi @jlittle, So I originally had them in MD and exported as a single mesh, then tried 2 separate meshes as well, and found I could better weight each piece of clothing separately without doing this whole "whack-a-mole" weighting weirdness in CC3.  But no matter what way, individual or separate, I still run into the same issue of CC3 doing weird weighting.  I am trying to learn Blender right now to see if that is any different.

@4u2ges thanks for the offer--just sent you a link via PM. I was able to mostly fix the mesh from the TPose when moved to APose as you mentioned; however, when I try to export the the model to FBX it crashes CC3 every single time--Obj works fine though for some reason (Support ticket opened).  I'm putting this in Unity so the cloth map isn't an option, I am trying to get as much of the animation done with regular bone animation, and then playing around with Alembic (Cloth) + Bone (Character) as a better option for true cloth simulation (exported from MarvelousD.). Like what this workload shows (https://blogs.unity3d.com/2017/12/04/adam-the-evolution-of-alembic-support-in-unity/).