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By Eric C (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Dear iCloners,
Thank you for your continuous support, and we simply could not have gone this far without your enthusiastic participation.
In 2019, we developed our Python-scripted plugins, and introduced our Unreal Live Link plugin to you.
We hope this has helped many of you in your plans, ideas and 3D projects!
We have read through your numerous forum posts and the feedback tracker, and now it's time to look forward and see what we will bring in 2020.
This post is for sharing iClone's roadmap with all the relevant technical breakthroughs we have achieved!
*Some new features may require the purchase of additional content and plugins. For sales related inquiries, please wait for further notices from Reallusion.
SSS Shader for Accessories & Props (CC 3.3 / iClone 7.8)Besides the update for CC characters, props, accessories, now non-standard characters will be able to have SSS shader in CC 3.3 and iClone 7.8. With the SSS shader, users are able to create translucent material effects, and a built-in SSS material library in the coming update.  See this quick demo on applying SSS shader to a prop.
CC Digital Human Features (CC 3.4 / iClone 7.9)
Please note that iClone users are entitled to a free Character Creator 3 (for iClone version), and all major character updates will be supported by iClone as well. CC3 + Character Base: support animated tear line and occlusion mesh in eye animation Facial Hair System: mustache and beard can move along with facial expression and lipsync animation Wrinkle System: facial morphs can drive diffuse and normal texture blend, users can define custom wrinkle patterns for different characters.
Visit CC page (here) for detailed introduction. Enhanced Facial Lip-sync (iClone 7.9)- A highly accurate viseme generation based on voice detection will be added (supports English, French, German in the first release)
- Facial animation can be driven by audio strength for different animation styles
- Enhanced smooth lip algorithm for co-articulation.
Pipeline for 3rd Party Tools
We will keep enhancing the pipeline between mainstream 3D tools with iClone:
#Unreal Engine
Updates along with CC 3.3 and iClone 7.8:
iClone Unreal Live Link Plugin 1.2- Direct transfer iClone props and link animation
- Direct transfer of iClone non-human skin-bone characters and link animation
- Direct transfer cloth physics attributes
- Direct transfer iClone characters' collision shape to Unreal (it might take some minor adjustments to get ideal results)
iClone 8 - What’s in the Lab Now !
This is for YOU! Our amazing iClone community have been so supportive with their forum suggestions and Feedback Tracker reporting, this has enabled us to include many new powerful visual features into the development of iClone 8.
Hot from the Reallusion Lab -- here we share some videos that we know will bring a smile to some your faces ! :)
Visual Enhancements - Mirror - the number one voted feature from the Feedback Tracker. This mirror object works as a plane which can be placed anywhere.
- Lens Flare - supports multiple lens flare patterns and custom features.
- Volumetric Light - yes, the God rays are here! This works beautifully with particle effects.
- Motion Blur - to bring more film effects to animated objects and cameras
- See the difference after using the combined effects
*Helicopter and vehicle props courtesy of Adolf Antareus. Visit their page and see more details: (helicopter) (pickup)
- Enhanced TAA for Animated Render
Comparing to iClone7, TAA designed for static frame render, the newly enhanced TAA can effectively remove alias flickering in animation, and give a much faster render output.
This is just a beginning, there will be more exciting things to come... Please STAY TUNED and thanks for your patience and support.
The Reallusion Team
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By charly Rama - 5 Years Ago
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Waouh, amazing. You guys are one of firms who really listen to your customers. Can't wait for all this
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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Yeah, great news!
Looking forward to the new facial lip-sync!
Thoug the iClone 8 features are way more impressive :w00t:
Well, we will have to wait at least another year for that. Probably even longer... :ermm:
Thanx anyway!
Finally mirrors and volumetric lights will spicy my work:satisfied:
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By linus10111 - 5 Years Ago
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I'm definitely looking forward to advanced lipsync!
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By davidjosue007 - 5 Years Ago
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Very great enhancements, can't wait to see that !
Good Job to RL team !
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By StyleMarshal - 5 Years Ago
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WoW , want and need all of this , great job , RL :) Mirror , Motion Blur , I can't believe ;-)
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By facr73 - 5 Years Ago
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Wow,
That's fantastic. Great news.
"A highly accurate viseme generation based on voice detection will be added (supports English, French, German in the first release) "
I hope Portuguese is in the roadmap as well.
Greets
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By nealtucker - 5 Years Ago
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All great stuff BUT....for fear of missing the boat, why not bring it out now? they have it working after all? at least the lights and mirror stuff, waiting another year is crazy to me, I'm getting all these...and better results in Unreal after being pointed in their direction by RL.
Ok I'm still learning but after a year of really getting to know UR, why would I bother spending hard-earned cash on something I already have and can do? Plus Unreal will be another year more advanced....Have you seen their road-map? Wow!
And just to be clear, I have already spent and been spending my money on some great and affordable Unreal assets rather than in the usual iClone store, iClone and CC stuff will still have a place in my workflow but not as much as it was.
My advice would be to get all this stuff out now and ASAP...not in a years Time
N.
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By Postfrosch - 5 Years Ago
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Dear RL team
there are some great things coming up to us in 2020. (especially on those de may need it)
Unfortunately, the mirror function will only be available in IClone 8 next year (or even later). We have been waiting for this function for 6 years now (in IC 5 there was the working mirror - from IC 6 no longer).
Why are we now6 waiting 1 year?
Why can't you publish the mirror in IC 7.8 or 7.9.
That would actually be a concession to loyal (old) users
Why do Live Link and Auto Upload updates work for Unreal?
Greetings from Germany
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By jstanleynwo - 5 Years Ago
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Love the direction and excited for the future of reallusion team. I have one question or at least a concern.
I was curious was the unity pipeline ever be updated? Will unity user get a live link. I would love to be able to do some of the live link features within unity..
Thanks
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By GOETZIWOOD STUDIOS - 5 Years Ago
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SSS, Mirror, Lens Flares, Volumetric Lights, Motion Blur, .. here we go, at last!
Awesome ;)
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By justaviking - 5 Years Ago
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Really great to see the road map. Many exciting things to look forward to.
I was expecting (hoping) that iC8 would scheduled for late 2020. I wonder how long into 2021 it will be before we see it.
The mirror is great news, though it does sound like it's a "special prop" and is not generalize reflection capability. Still, I (and others) have said that having even a single flat mirror will probably satisfy 90% of our mirror needs. So I'm not complaining already, just observing and interpreting what was described. Really looking forward to having it.
Mirror + Motion blur + Volumetrics = Many happy people.
While we wait for iC8, the updates to iC7 will be nice too. I'm really looking forward to the improved lip sync. SSS on props (supported without having to cheat) will be nice to have too.
Thanks for the road map, Reallusion.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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Besides many other desirable features, I'm happy to see that two of my long-time requests, a mirror and improved lip-syncing, will now become a reality and not just an illusion....:P
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By thebiz.movies - 5 Years Ago
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Lip syncing improvements..yes please!
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By wires - 5 Years Ago
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Excellent news with many long awaited features. :):cool:
Pipeline for 3rd Party Tools We will keep enhancing the pipeline between mainstream 3D tools with iClone:
Does this mean that 3DXchange will also get updated? :Whistling:
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By Galfridus - 5 Years Ago
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Does RL still consider Iclone their “Flagship” product? This 2020 road map appears to confirm, as was the case in 2019, a subsidiary status toCC3. The majority of the map seems to be delivery of updates to maintain Iclone`s compatibility with the previously announced developments for CC3.I find this thread decidedly underwhelming regarding any specific and exclusive Iclone improvements for this year with perhaps advanced lip syncing being the exception. The additional sneak peek beyond 2020 to Iclone 8 is therefore particularly welcome. In reality those desirable future features could still be almost another 2 years away if RL plan a Q4 2021 release. In the mean time will Iclone become as tired and stagnant as the current 3DXchange ? I very much appreciate the privilege of seeing the 2020 road map but fear, at least for the mid term, it continues to restrict Icloners to yet more off road parking and limited travel in a slow lane. Perhaps its a consequence of my preferring the RL limo to a game engine juggernaut. Geoff.:unsure:
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By gordryd - 5 Years Ago
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I agree with Geoff -- I appreciate the roadmap, but it just re-iterates the features already announced for CC3. The iC8 announcement (without any date) seems like a tease, with at least another year of waiting until some of the desired features actually get implemented.
Also curious if RTX (ray-tracing) will be supported in iC8?
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By RobertoColombo - 5 Years Ago
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Great job RL!
But I am sure that's just the beginning and many additional cool features will see the light in iClone 8
Cheers
Roberto
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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well, if you ask me, which you didn't :w00t:....everything RL is mentioning for 8 ...should be in 7.....and RL's goals for iclone 8 should be to knock the crown off of keyshot - iclone 8 needs to be an industry standard. Other than high poly and an Ez ray tracing engine (that doesn't have some crazy ...takes 500 files or does'nt do particles catch ..something legit, which you can get a free open source version on the net, Iclone is superior to keyshot... - 8 should be about an iclone with a superior choice of render engines and the ability to take high poly models, That's the money version for hollywood, and this version 7 is the money version for game-engines.
Maybe for something innovative on the rendering, Amazon rendering in the cloud - can make something subscription'ish - https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/deadline-10-launch-a-rendering-fleet-in-aws/
https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/
if money is a thing, then just sell the mirror and fx stuff as plug in's or add ons for the meanwhile.
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By Alasandro - 5 Years Ago
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The Mirror!!!! FINALLY!
However, having to wait up to another year in the iClone 8 release? Wish you hadn't mentioned it at all. :(
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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Hi,
Why wait till 2021 when it is already ready ?
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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Perfect ERIC !! Perfect!!
You can ask to the Business Development team that I'm ready to pre-order for a beta version like E-Onsoftware did with PlantFactory :)
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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uvz (3/7/2020)
Hi,
Why wait till 2021 when it is already ready ?
There is a difference between a prototype/proof of concept and a production version.
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By jazzsinger56 - 5 Years Ago
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That all looks amazing, BUT-----
I only purchased iclone 7 LAST WEEK!
How long until it becomes iclone 8???? I looked for information before I bought (I'm a 63 year old student with cancer - so I was very grateful for the student discount)-- but I can't come up with any more money for it - even though Uni will certainly upgrade when you guys release the new one.
I looked for info on when there might be a version 8 before I bought, but couldn't find anything. I guess I should have asked the sales team, huh.
When will it be released, please?
Cheryl
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By Stintfang - 5 Years Ago
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I wonder if it is too late for feature requests.
I definetely need an improvement on the render settings to start rendering an animation from negative values so that particle engines can spread their outcome before the real rendering of the scene begins. It is always so annoying having to setup the scene with 200 frames in mind before a number of clouds have been generated and distributed.
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By jjacksonantunes - 5 Years Ago
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AGUARDANDO ANSIOSO PELAS NOVAS FERRAMENTAS, ICLONE O MELHOR EM ANIMAÇÃO EM TEMPO REAL QUE EXISTE. QUE VENHA AS NOVIDADES!
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By james_muia - 5 Years Ago
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Flares, volumetric lighting, motion blur. Mirrors! Fantastic work, all things that can increase the quality of our productions. Can't wait to see what else is in store!
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By WarLord - 5 Years Ago
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Some great features that are badly needed. Nice to see the proofs going so well. Excellent job of managing your development resources for a wide user base instead of focusing on a few items with a narrow reach. And thanks for listening to all the clamor over the years as it is paying off in a powerful animation tool.
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By thedirector1974 - 5 Years Ago
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Stintfang (3/7/2020)
I wonder if it is too late for feature requests.
I definetely need an improvement on the render settings to start rendering an animation from negative values so that particle engines can spread their outcome before the real rendering of the scene begins. It is always so annoying having to setup the scene with 200 frames in mind before a number of clouds have been generated and distributed.
That's already there. Just look in the render options, the last entry ...
Greetings, Direx
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By Peter (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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jazzsinger56 (3/7/2020)
That all looks amazing, BUT-----
I only purchased iclone 7 LAST WEEK!
How long until it becomes iclone 8???? I looked for information before I bought (I'm a 63 year old student with cancer - so I was very grateful for the student discount)-- but I can't come up with any more money for it - even though Uni will certainly upgrade when you guys release the new one.
I looked for info on when there might be a version 8 before I bought, but couldn't find anything. I guess I should have asked the sales team, huh.
When will it be released, please?
Cheryl
Hi Cheryl
As the roadmap shows, development of iClone 8 will continue throughout the year. At the very earliest it won't appear until late 2020 or early 2021 but this of course depends on how development progresses.
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By jazzsinger56 - 5 Years Ago
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Thank you, Peter. I did see the roadmap but assumed you continued working on it after release as you have with iClone7. I just needed to start saving for it.
Does Character Creator 3 get upgraded at the same time? Sorry, absolutely newbie here - just moved over from Daz3d. Daz + iClone are the tag team winners in 3D animation in the "mega results for less work" category. You guys do great work.
Thanks for your patience.
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By AniMajik - 5 Years Ago
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All of these updates sound great! I'm looking forward to the Lip Sync enhancements, but they all sound good. Motion blur and lens flare are things I can accomplish in AE now (and do), but it would be nice to have in iClone. The new renderer also looks good too.
You guys have been busy!
-AniMajik
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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My favorite thing is the Flares!
If there is a Flares-25 pack, I am buying it!
And if we can tweak the colors and add alpha maps...!!!!!
ME WANT NOW
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By andrewlargin - 5 Years Ago
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Thankyou for the roadmap, it looks interesting. I was hoping for more, always, simply because my skill set is limited and anything that does things more easily overcomes my deficits. However I have realised that I am nowhere near using the potential of iclone 7 and CC3 so I got a year of practice to get better and then when iclone 8 comes along you never know, I might make something real good. You also said "this is just a beginning, there will be more exciting things to come..." so I am not disappointed. Off to do an animation tutorial as that is one of my real weaknesses innit.
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By rogyru - 5 Years Ago
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Roadmap looks great, look forward to trying out the new tools and improvements :)
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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Actually RL - please overhaul in iC8 the way iClone searches its content folders.
The current code can't handle large sized folders, and sometimes goes into endless loading circles, then when you click on iClone, it goes white "Not Responding" then crashes.
Showcase great content, but make the experience bug-free and easy.
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By sherifdaizer - 5 Years Ago
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Hi
Thank you all reallusion's team for every thing.... I'm waiting for all updates & the new Iclone 8 & every thing.
I wish you can put many things that I think it's very important for I clone.
like (( Toon Shader, Sketch, ink or paint render... and Stretch Bones for body and face to make characters more cartoonist stylist ))
Hope you can import or create something like this.
That's all I thinking in my head right now.
Thanks
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By oisilener1982 - 5 Years Ago
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When can we have a more realistic render engine in iClone? I've seen the demo reel for iClone and it is disappointing in terms of quality. I know iClone is fast and easy to use so please improve the render quality
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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oisilener1982 (3/9/2020)
When can we have a more realistic render engine in iClone? I've seen the demo reel for iClone and it is disappointing in terms of quality. I know iClone is fast and easy to use so please improve the render quality
Whatever RL offers, it's never enough...:doze:
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By rosuckmedia - 5 Years Ago
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@RL
Good news,
I will wait and be surprised.
My favorite so far is volumetric lights.
An improved native renderer would be nice.
Kind regards rosuckmedia
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Die Sound-Funktion ist auf 200 Zeichen begrenzt |
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By Eric C (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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Hello all,
We have mistaken the dates for the facial hair system, which should be ready with iClone 7.9 :)
Apologize again and thank you all for the amazing support at forum!
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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thx for amazing features. i am happy reallusion will wait a little more for RTX.
with this new updates iclone will be the most complete realtime engine around.
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By oisilener1982 - 5 Years Ago
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animagic (3/9/2020)
oisilener1982 (3/9/2020)
When can we have a more realistic render engine in iClone? I've seen the demo reel for iClone and it is disappointing in terms of quality. I know iClone is fast and easy to use so please improve the render qualityWhatever RL offers, it's never enough... :doze:
iClone currently does not have anything that comes even close to Redshift/Vray/Arnold. I just wish for iCLone to have a decent renderer someday. I appreciate iClone for being the most user friendly 3D software. It is easy to use and fun but there is something lacking in the quality of the output.
The Demo reels are fine if I am writing this 5 years ago. Im just a super beginner and I'm still learning iClone, 3DS Max (for tyFlow and Phoenix FD) and Cinema 4d. I really like everything about iClone except for the renderer.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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many ppl , like to say " this is unrealistic " "this looks gamish " but if you ask what makes a render looks good. he dont know why or how
or what need. just gonna say. "use iray. use octane use redshift this renders are realistic "
its not productive. its useless. what make a work looks good is the artist not the tool.
you can use mainstream tools and be a mediocre artist. and make mediocre artwork.
about the videos showcases, reallusion dont want to make a good render they just want to show the new resources , the work to make it
looks good or "realistic" its about the artist.
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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What else is on the cards besides the one already mentioned for 2021.
Some suggestions for the 2021
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
8. Render Layers
9. Render Layers Like RPF / RLA
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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uvz (3/9/2020)
What else is on the cards besides the one already mentioned for 2021.
Some suggestions for the 2021
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
1 - event based particles you cant find it on realtime game engines. now in unity with HDRP and new Vfxgraph node you can do that but is really new and in preview. you can use event particles from your 3d software content creation and bake it for any game engine. i bake particle flow from max to iclone if in some case popcornfx cant do what i want. you dont konw that ? lol
2 - lol
3 - you can do motion tracking in after effects and export the camera to iclone in fbx . you dont know that ? lol
4 - you can bake particles from any 3d software to iclone and can import cameras too.
5 - i dont use any integration for mudbox, and i really dont want it . really you want a bridge for blender? lol
6 - the big guys game engines are starting to make tests and previews with complex particle fx and its all in preview and not production ready , and you really need reallusion do it with iclone ? lol
7 iclone with modeling tools ?? but its a animation software lol?
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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but you touch in one point reallusion need to consider
render layers.
the output render with effects still problematic. the actual supersampling /fullscreen render and effects are a big mess. and need
to be corrected. now iclone gonna have more effects need a big eye to correct all this mess in render output part. and for many
studios. render layers are important. but with render layers iclone must render in exr 16 or 32 bits color output. HBAO+ is good. but
is not enough. VXAO is a lot better and for "PRO" quality in realtime iclone must consider render separated layers for, depth, AO ( with a better ao ) and all render pass you can find on a "pro" render. unity and unreal already offer it. and its a important thing reallusion must consider to get attention from the big guys studios .
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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a bridge to blender might be a good thing, blender does get to use Octane Render Free for indies / hobbyists.
but for Reallusion to gain the marmoset and keyshot audience, they should be something Native'ish as well.
search artstation for marmoset and keyshot users, Reallusion wants that audience. and they will have it after they add high poly, and a quality render engine alternative - dont replace what we have, just an alternate choice, the same way we choose a physics engine.
use cycles - https://www.cycles-renderer.org/ or https://luxcorerender.org/ then run an instance of it on Amazon and sell render farm time.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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planetstardragon (3/9/2020)
a bridge to blender might be a good thing, blender does get to use Octane Render Free for indies / hobbyists. but for Reallusion to gain the marmoset and keyshot audience, they should be something Native'ish as well. search artstation for marmoset and keyshot users, Reallusion wants that audience. and they will have it after they add high poly, and a quality render engine alternative - dont replace what we have, just an alternate choice, the same way we choose a physics engine. use cycles - https://www.cycles-renderer.org/ or https://luxcorerender.org/ then run an instance of it on Amazon and sell render farm time.
for reallusion get marmoset audience. they dont want to do nothing more. actualy toolbag and iclone are equal in resources. toolbag have screenspace reflections but the AO system is bad with lack of control. and is very easy get flicker on renders. on iclone you have a better vxgi system than toolbag. almost flicker free renders . more ao control with HBAO+ now iclone have a better and more complete material system and a good solved shadow system. its not about the render features is about the comunity work
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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i really can deal with actual HBAO+ from iclone, for some time already i save my projects per cameras so i can get individual controls
per camera for HBAO+ settings. but is not good enough . actualy unity in hdrp use screen space AO , like unreal. do and you can see
a lot of scripts doing a great job for AO in unity. i believe will be a problem put a screenspace AO system on actual iclone with VXGI
so i believe will be more easy to the team to put VXAO to work like was the promisse when iclone 7 was released.
this is one of the best rasterized AO i ever see
but iclone HBAO+ is almost good like this. if you undestand the limitations and avoid that.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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double post
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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about effects and render output just a example
if you render in 1080p with a monitor in 1080p desktop. using static noise effect in preview not full screen render aceleration. you get a result
if you use fullscreen acelerator you get another result. if you use full screen aceleration and supersampling you get ANOTHER result
if you change the desktop resolution for 4k you change all resuts and create another variations of results. i realy dont believe reallusion
dont realize that yet.
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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@wildstar - given your experience with the various engines - what would be your dream scenario for a Ray tracing render engine that would attract marmoset and keyshot users ?
that is my core focus, what can iclone do that would make marmoset and keyshot users say Iclone is the best choice of all.
This is a question that Reallusion would never ask (publicly), and one of the perks of me being ok with being the crazy bad guy. #noscruples lol
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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planetstardragon (3/9/2020)
@wildstar - given your experience with the various engines - what would be your dream scenario for a Ray tracing render engine that would attract marmoset and keyshot users ?
that is my core focus, what can iclone do that would make marmoset and keyshot users say Iclone is the best choice of all.
This is a question that Reallusion would never ask (publicly), and one of the perks of me being ok with being the crazy bad guy. #noscruples lol
i make some tests with keyshot but keyshot was not support for vertex deformations in fbx or alembics at time i test it so i stoped use it.
but i can talk about marmoset toolbag very welll cause for a time . was my choice to render my works for archviz and motion animation
for my clients. toolbag have problems on vxgi side cause it have 2 things iclone dont have. toolbag have ultra high quality high sampled
soft shadows. the shadow quality of toolbag is ridiculuos looks like raytrace shadows. and toolbag have native screen space reflections. but for other side. its very hard dont get flicker on complex situations on toolbag. the way you control ambient occlusion on toolbag looks like a raytrace render engine. so you cant increase or decrease AO manual. it appear in dark situations and dissapear in very strong light sittuations. its the correct way but in realtime world where nothing is correct. is better the control come from artist. my point. when you know how to use VXAO from toolbag you realize how strong and accurate it is. now the shader on iclone is very complete if you know how to use that
will be a more tool to get good renders and better look for stuff inside iclone( more complete than toolbag ). like i already say ...many things change on iclone since 7.7 release , and to be very true and i hope no one get mad with that,, i dont see any work or showcase using all iclone new powers. screen space reflections are pure trash, i test it on unity a lot of diferent scripts, on toolbag and unreal. and all trash. now in unity HDRP they put a reflection dummy and is the same way iclone 8 will work is a correct decision( the actual iclone light/shadows system looks like unity HDRP but without bugs and this is great ! ) . realtime raytracing (rtx) is a dream for any realtime artist like me. but is not ready yet. on both sides unity and unreal. in my opnion unity is ahead on this race. they solution for RTX is more light , run better on GTX cards than unreal. but have a lot of problems and is not usable for comercial projects yet , so is not perfect cenario for rtx yet . maybe in 2021. but VXGI on iclone is now powered by new features. and yes you can get amazing results with that.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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a perfect scenario for iclone 8 is if reallusion upgrade for VXGI 2.0 and use VXAO . but i love all this new releases is already amazing
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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VXGI is comparable to RTX on past before 7.7 the old light system f* with iclone vxgi ( its the same you can find on unreal )
now with the new light system you can know you can get the same results. the problem in iclone yet is performance.
VXGI vs RTX on infiltrator scene .
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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VXGI 2.0 . i believe will be more easy to implement on iclone 8. and is more fast than vxgi 1. with more quality and more complete
resources.
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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But is that high poly friendly ? if you study the artstation list of users, you have 2 kinds of users - 1 that want to create for games, and 2 ...people that want illustrations for movies / magazines / advertising - ie - car manufacturers, coke a cola.... 1 is low poly, 2 is high poly. - there are more high poly professionals because it's many industries, where gaming has more hobbyists. - so high poly is an important factor.
The biggest edge Iclone has at this moment, is "Ez" which is the common pitch for both marmoset and keyshot, and also why everyone just doesn't use blender since it does everything and is free.
in a practical freelance sense - you will sooner land a gig doing renders for a popular fashion blog, than getting a freelance gig at ubisoft or blizzard - thus more professionals in high poly.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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i work with sculpt and all sculpt workflow is focused to reduce polys . the superman suit you say is riped from a game. you or the other guy
i dont remember. was sculpted using dinamic tesselation. with low polycount so the work of retopo is very fast. on comercial renders
you need to work with low poly count. is up to artist make choices for quality/performance on render. for games how much detail with less
polys you can get more better will be your feedback with your clients on game production world. all this things i research about, i have
a project to produce a feature animation film using a realtime engine and after 7.7 i decided its iclone. cause i animate all things inside it
but i make a lot of research to reach this decision.
for example . on unity for realtime playback and render you can deal with 10 milions polys without lose performance. and something like
20 iclone avatars without lose FPS. iclone on past have problems with many lights, many cameras. many clips all this things make iclone bad for complex animation scenarios. on iclone 7.3 or 7.4 i dont remember all this problems was corrected. like i sayed my matrix animation is not better on refinament for motions and animations cause the project was impossible to edit at end. i just cant navigate on my scene project so slow it was. now the unique thing slow down the iclone perfomance are animated props. and nohuman vertex animations. ( things with bones like wings. ) this still slowling iclone a looot , i working on a angel animation and i passing bad moments with iclone. vxgi can slow down you fps till 4 fps if your project is complex. i working right now with 5 milion polys and its ok. iclone is increasing is improving., and in a universe where unity and unreal are tottaly broked with bugs in RTX. getting iclone working ok its a great merit for reallusion ..
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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no, I was the one that said his cape was wrinkled and he looked like he fell asleep at the bar. :w00t::P
so you are saying this is your choice for a better iclone render ? https://developer.nvidia.com/vxgi
and on high poly, some artists are just illustrators and probably get a high poly model from someone else - for example an ad agency will hire a modeler, but then have one of their artists render it - if you read how people reviewed keyshot, most of them aren't deep into the technical aspects - they just had high poly models, and keyshot made it ez to render them. Some modelers want, and need to keep their models high poly and just want a quick render. Many of them seem to be more into texturing and lighting than modeling, in that aspect Iclone already has great texturing tools and lighting tools for that audience.
Going low poly from high poly while keeping much detail is an advanced level skill that takes time to do, these people are using these softwares over maya or blender because it's easy and fast....not because they have the training or time to use maya or blender.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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when it comes to animation it need to be reduced. not much like on a realtime engine.
a character sculpted on mudbox without tesselation meshs can go easy to 5 bilions polys its impossible to animate it. so the model
must go down for 1 milion polys ( if you have a powerfull render farm ) or for some like 200/300 k polys. actualy iclone can deal with
180 k polys 9 ( per character ) without lose performance, its like i said its a thec decision from artist. thinking on hardware resources. about render. a static high poly model you can do it inside zbrush if you want. pro render for pro work need some optimization. so if you think about create 3d ilustrations using high poly you dont want CC3 or genesis bases. just sculpt it. retopo it paint in substance and render inside substance using iray,
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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iclone already use it https://developer.nvidia.com/vxgi
in its version 1.0 . like toolbag use it too. actuly the most poor version of VXGI is that one running on twinmotion.
i sugest to iclone upgrade for 2.0
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By planetstardragon - 5 Years Ago
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well the goal would be to get them over here, once they are here yall can make tutorials for them on the proper ways to animate.
I totally appreciate what you are saying being that I learned animation from a low poly view - but I can appreciate their view as well,
"I just want to render this today, not a week from today after 10 hours of tutorials and lectures, no render, no pay, ok ?!" heh
look at the keyshot website, look at how they describe it - they aren't describing it to a maya crowd
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By AutoDidact - 5 Years Ago
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It is good to see them implmenting Motion blur and at least simulate mirror reflections via a new "mirror object" However IMHO, Professional animation and VFX companies will never use Iclone for final delivery until RL implements a Modern Scene Management Panel Like the outliner in Maya Max or Blender 2.8x. Hi poly or low poly makes no difference when you have the manage & orgnanize possibly hundreds of scene elements and you need the ability to fold them up in nested,separated, NAMED Drag & drop hierarchies for easy object parenting, hiding/unhiding of collections&elements for large complex scene building. Frankly this is mission impossible with the primitive scene item panel presently in Iclone.🙄 Also those of us, who model our own realtime optimized content, need a better way to import it into iclone other than the 32 bit 3DXchange which does not even allow for user defined scaling import pre-sets. I recently Migrated all of my Daz content creation from Maxon C4D over to Blender 2.8x and already have a smooth import /export pipeline due to both Daz studio's and Blenders ability to save user defined presets for scaling and X,Y,Z facing coordinates upon import/ export. Most of the Iclone animations ,you see online, have a "small stage set" look due to this severe limitation of the Iclone scene manager and content import& Management tools .😌
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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AutoDidact (3/10/2020)
It is good to see them implmenting Motion blur and at least simulate mirror reflections via a new "mirror object" However IMHO, Professional animation and VFX companies will never use Iclone for final delivery until RL implements a Modern Scene Management Panel Like the outliner in Maya Max or Blender 2.8x. Hi poly or low poly makes no difference when you have the manage & orgnanize possibly hundreds of scene elements and you need the ability to fold them up in nested,separated, NAMED Drag & drop hierarchies for easy object parenting, hiding/unhiding of collections&elements for large complex scene building. Frankly this is mission impossible with the primitive scene item panel presently in Iclone.🙄 Also those of us, who model our own realtime optimized content, need a better way to import it into iclone other than the 32 bit 3DXchange which does not even allow for user defined scaling import pre-sets. I recently Migrated all of my Daz content creation from Maxon C4D over to Blender 2.8x and already have a smooth import /export pipeline due to both Daz studio's and Blenders ability to save user defined presets for scaling and X,Y,Z facing coordinates upon import/ export. Most of the Iclone animations ,you see online, have a "small stage set" look due to this severe limitation of the Iclone scene manager and content import& Management tools .😌
AGREE. i use iclone but i dont like the way we need to manage props on scene and on timeline. when the scene is complex. start to be a pain manage many assets .
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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wildstar (3/9/2020)
uvz (3/9/2020)
What else is on the cards besides the one already mentioned for 2021.
Some suggestions for the 2021
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
1 - event based particles you cant find it on realtime game engines. now in unity with HDRP and new Vfxgraph node you can do that but is really new and in preview. you can use event particles from your 3d software content creation and bake it for any game engine. i bake particle flow from max to iclone if in some case popcornfx cant do what i want. you dont konw that ? lol 2 - lol 3 - you can do motion tracking in after effects and export the camera to iclone in fbx . you dont know that ? lol 4 - you can bake particles from any 3d software to iclone and can import cameras too. 5 - i dont use any integration for mudbox, and i really dont want it . really you want a bridge for blender? lol 6 - the big guys game engines are starting to make tests and previews with complex particle fx and its all in preview and not production ready , and you really need reallusion do it with iclone ? lol 7 iclone with modeling tools ?? but its a animation software lol?
With Stuck in a maze of lol that I do not know which one to address first ;)
7. iClone has a GoZ pipeline so why not a Blender one.
6. I am not a Game Developer so Unreal and Unity are not my domain to comment on
5. There is a GoZ iClone pipeline but I can neither afford ZBrush or Mudboz. My software of choice is Blender Besides Reallusion 3D products.
4. I know about importing Camera but I have no clue to importing Particles into iClone. - Do you know of a tutorial that shows how to. Please share the tutorial.
3. I don't have After Effects. My Compositor of choice is Blender. I quoted After Effects because it is easier to relate to its features.
2. Then again Adding Layers and Masks should not be a mammoth task to implement. These are just color adjustment on certain areas so I think it should be doable. Also is it possible to bring in a camera track from Blender. Could you find a tutorial if possible.
1.. I have seen PopcornFX 2 which is event driven. I have seen 3ds max's Event Driven Particle systems so I seek one within iClone (Not for Game Engines). Also PopcornFX Version 2 is an event driven particle system for Unity since more than a year.
So please share
1. Particle Camera into iClone
2. 3D Tracking with Camera into iClone with Blender if possible
Many Thanks
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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Motion Blur, Volumetric Lighting, Lens Flare are usually Post Production FX .
All these are processing heavy when done in 3D.
Even though it will be good to have all these FX and even more but I hope it does not impact the render time adversely.
Should Reallusion also consider a Compositor Add On to complement iClone instead of burdening the 3D Render Engine.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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uvz (3/10/2020)
wildstar (3/9/2020)
uvz (3/9/2020)
What else is on the cards besides the one already mentioned for 2021.
Some suggestions for the 2021
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
1 - event based particles you cant find it on realtime game engines. now in unity with HDRP and new Vfxgraph node you can do that but is really new and in preview. you can use event particles from your 3d software content creation and bake it for any game engine. i bake particle flow from max to iclone if in some case popcornfx cant do what i want. you dont konw that ? lol 2 - lol 3 - you can do motion tracking in after effects and export the camera to iclone in fbx . you dont know that ? lol 4 - you can bake particles from any 3d software to iclone and can import cameras too. 5 - i dont use any integration for mudbox, and i really dont want it . really you want a bridge for blender? lol 6 - the big guys game engines are starting to make tests and previews with complex particle fx and its all in preview and not production ready , and you really need reallusion do it with iclone ? lol 7 iclone with modeling tools ?? but its a animation software lol? With Stuck in a maze of lol that I do not know which one to address first ;) 7. iClone has a GoZ pipeline so why not a Blender one. 6. I am not a Game Developer so Unreal and Unity are not my domain to comment on 5. There is a GoZ iClone pipeline but I can neither afford ZBrush or Mudboz. My software of choice is Blender Besides Reallusion 3D products. 4. I know about importing Camera but I have no clue to importing Particles into iClone. - Do you know of a tutorial that shows how to. Please share the tutorial. 3. I don't have After Effects. My Compositor of choice is Blender. I quoted After Effects because it is easier to relate to its features. 2. Then again Adding Layers and Masks should not be a mammoth task to implement. These are just color adjustment on certain areas so I think it should be doable. Also is it possible to bring in a camera track from Blender. Could you find a tutorial if possible. 1.. I have seen PopcornFX 2 which is event driven. I have seen 3ds max's Event Driven Particle systems so I seek one within iClone (Not for Game Engines). Also PopcornFX Version 2 is an event driven particle system for Unity since more than a year. So please share 1. Particle Camera into iClone 2. 3D Tracking with Camera into iClone with Blender if possible Many Thanks
7 - a bridge for zbrush is good , when i talk this is not so important is cause i use mudbox to create content and sculpt cc3 bases on mudbox without any bridge so you can do the same with blender. so its not a critical needed feature.
6 - i talk about game engines cause event based particles its not a natural/normal thing in game engines and talk about the big ones.
unity and unreal dont have event based particles. ( already have but in preview not ready for comercial use ) and you asking to reallusion put it in iclone when popcornfx already is a powerfull weapon to create particles. and you always can bake your particles from 3dmax/c4d/blender . i bake particle flow particles into iclone using a script i am max user so i cant help you with blender ( i hate blender )
4 - already answered on 6
3 i say lol cause , comunity know this is not priority to reallusion put a composer/edit inside iclone . they already have much problems to solve.
2 - like i said you can bake particle flow(3dmax ) to import in iclone as fbx animation . like you can do for any game engine. just search on internet for bake particles to game engines like unity or unreal.
1 i already made some tests exporting tracked cameras as fbx cameras to iclone but i dont have much sucess . the objects looks sliding
i believe will be something about the fact iclone works internal as 60 fps . when all cameras work as 29.97 /30fps .but you can do that easy just track your camera and export it as fbx camera and import in iclone. i made it using after effects and a script called fbx exporter.
peace
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By Data Juggler - 5 Years Ago
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Will IClone 8 support 60 FPS? That and less flickering are my two biggest wishes.
7.7.2 seems to flicker if an object is selected more than before.
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By thedirector1974 - 5 Years Ago
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Data Juggler (3/11/2020)
Will IClone 8 support 60 FPS? That and less flickering are my two biggest wishes.
7.7.2 seems to flicker if an object is selected more than before.
What do you mean by 60fps? You can already render in 60fps.
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By Data Juggler - 5 Years Ago
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No, it is 30 FPS, because half of them are discarded.
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By wires - 5 Years Ago
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Data Juggler (3/11/2020)
No, it is 30 FPS, because half of them are discarded.
Wrong, you can select 60 fps for a final render in any video format:
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By Data Juggler - 5 Years Ago
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Is that 60 FPS new? Because I swear I remember asking this a couple of years ago and not getting this answer.
Thank you, I will count this as what I learned today, and take the rest of the day off.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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iclone work internal as 60 fps since always i believe. when render you have choice to down to 30 fps.
for me this is the big reason i cant get acurate camera tracking inside iclone
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By Angel Alonso - 5 Years Ago
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Great!!!!....impatient to be able to play with all this :)
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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Data Juggler (3/11/2020)
Is that 60 FPS new? Because I swear I remember asking this a couple of years ago and not getting this answer.
Thank you, I will count this as what I learned today, and take the rest of the day off.
It is partially new because for a long time you couldn't get 60 FPS with MP4. Must have been changed at some point.
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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twinmotion is out and change from VXGI to screen space GI. screen space AO are incridible accurate too. will be amazing if
iclone 8 use this concepts.
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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wildstar (3/10/2020)
uvz (3/10/2020)
wildstar (3/9/2020)
uvz (3/9/2020)
What else is on the cards besides the one already mentioned for 2021.
Some suggestions for the 2021
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
1 - event based particles you cant find it on realtime game engines. now in unity with HDRP and new Vfxgraph node you can do that but is really new and in preview. you can use event particles from your 3d software content creation and bake it for any game engine. i bake particle flow from max to iclone if in some case popcornfx cant do what i want. you dont konw that ? lol 2 - lol 3 - you can do motion tracking in after effects and export the camera to iclone in fbx . you dont know that ? lol 4 - you can bake particles from any 3d software to iclone and can import cameras too. 5 - i dont use any integration for mudbox, and i really dont want it . really you want a bridge for blender? lol 6 - the big guys game engines are starting to make tests and previews with complex particle fx and its all in preview and not production ready , and you really need reallusion do it with iclone ? lol 7 iclone with modeling tools ?? but its a animation software lol? With Stuck in a maze of lol that I do not know which one to address first ;) 7. iClone has a GoZ pipeline so why not a Blender one. 6. I am not a Game Developer so Unreal and Unity are not my domain to comment on 5. There is a GoZ iClone pipeline but I can neither afford ZBrush or Mudboz. My software of choice is Blender Besides Reallusion 3D products. 4. I know about importing Camera but I have no clue to importing Particles into iClone. - Do you know of a tutorial that shows how to. Please share the tutorial. 3. I don't have After Effects. My Compositor of choice is Blender. I quoted After Effects because it is easier to relate to its features. 2. Then again Adding Layers and Masks should not be a mammoth task to implement. These are just color adjustment on certain areas so I think it should be doable. Also is it possible to bring in a camera track from Blender. Could you find a tutorial if possible. 1.. I have seen PopcornFX 2 which is event driven. I have seen 3ds max's Event Driven Particle systems so I seek one within iClone (Not for Game Engines). Also PopcornFX Version 2 is an event driven particle system for Unity since more than a year. So please share 1. Particle Camera into iClone 2. 3D Tracking with Camera into iClone with Blender if possible Many Thanks 7 - a bridge for zbrush is good , when i talk this is not so important is cause i use mudbox to create content and sculpt cc3 bases on mudbox without any bridge so you can do the same with blender. so its not a critical needed feature. 6 - i talk about game engines cause event based particles its not a natural/normal thing in game engines and talk about the big ones. unity and unreal dont have event based particles. ( already have but in preview not ready for comercial use ) and you asking to reallusion put it in iclone when popcornfx already is a powerfull weapon to create particles. and you always can bake your particles from 3dmax/c4d/blender . i bake particle flow particles into iclone using a script i am max user so i cant help you with blender ( i hate blender ) 4 - already answered on 6 3 i say lol cause , comunity know this is not priority to reallusion put a composer/edit inside iclone . they already have much problems to solve. 2 - like i said you can bake particle flow(3dmax ) to import in iclone as fbx animation . like you can do for any game engine. just search on internet for bake particles to game engines like unity or unreal. 1 i already made some tests exporting tracked cameras as fbx cameras to iclone but i dont have much sucess . the objects looks sliding i believe will be something about the fact iclone works internal as 60 fps . when all cameras work as 29.97 /30fps .but you can do that easy just track your camera and export it as fbx camera and import in iclone. i made it using after effects and a script called fbx exporter. peace
1. What is your Mudbox workflow. Please share a "Video Tutorial".
2. Which version of Max do you use and which Particle Baking Script are you referring to ? Can you please share a "Video Tutorial" ?
3. This is exactly why you need 3D Tracking inside of iClone because all your tests weren't up to your expectations.
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By alhimi5000 - 5 Years Ago
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iClone Light does not work through stained glass and does not give colored rays I hope it works in the future   
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By wildstar - 5 Years Ago
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if you show a example of some realtime raster render engine around. doing that. i give you a candy ... i believe rtx dont do that too but i need to test i not have sure.
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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wildstar (3/12/2020)
if you show a example of some realtime raster render engine around. doing that. i give you a candy ... i believe rtx dont do that too but i need to test i not have sure.
You can use PathTracing in UE4, it works almost like a slider the way they have it. You don't have to trace bounces if you don't want, but you can by setting the slider settings above 0.
in iC7, if you want to simulate/fake it, you could arrange 3 spotlights with the respective color they are supposed to be passing through. Stained glass you have to muck it some how to make it look multicolored I guess.
Yeah, if realtime engines had this computational ability it would effectively be raytracing. The reason why it is realtime is because it isn't computing these heavier calculations, so it can do its emulation thing fast.
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By Warped Reality VFX - 5 Years Ago
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Here is one method far from perfect, to achieve this effect using the spotlight.
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By uvz - 5 Years Ago
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DO NOT COMMENT. THIS IS ONLY FOR Team Reallusion
2021 Features
1. Event Based Particle Fx Engine where Particles can move from one event to another and be subjected to new conditions.
2. After Effects type Compositing with Layers and Adjustment Layers, Color Correction Limited Specific unlike the overall as with LUT.
3. Motion Tracking for outside footage and Camera import.
4. Particle Fx Import from 3rd party 3d applications along with Camera import
5. Blender integration for Sculpting and a similar to ZBrush GOZ pipeline for Blender
6. Event Driven Physics and Particle engine
7. Modelling Sculpting Tools without the need for ZBrush
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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@uvz: This is a public forum, so you can expect comments...:P
For example, if you propose something that doesn't make sense, we will comment. What you should do, is enter your suggestions in Feedback Tracker, so people can vote for them. The development team may or may not pay attention to what is posted on the forum.
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By ahingel - 5 Years Ago
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Will it transfer the spring bones animation too?
Because now, spring bones they dont transfer with live link
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By Ascensi - 5 Years Ago
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@Realusion I really hope you can squeeze in a soft body Vertex shader & editor, maybe that could be added to CC4 to use with the existing brushes then transferring the character to iClone, the soft cloth system receives the textures for all the custom painted body part areas or relies on the default Character weights. Big belly's or thick wrinkles in creature necks or double chins, thick thighs can then get the bouncy flesh it needs but also maybe someone can insert animated props inside the character to give custom shapes like a hand inside, veins, animated lungs etc. This has been added to the feedback tracker.
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By Wacky-Wabbit - 5 Years Ago
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GREAT!
I know that this may seem a bit far out, and some may say something like "WT@?" But what if it was possible, to take a legacy (i.e. G3, G4, G5 OR G6) character, send it to CC3, execute an algorithm on it (i.e. like the CC1 to CC3), and convert it to a CC character with reasonably similar looks? Dose this seem realistic, doable, or am I just wanting too much? I'm not spoiled though...just like what I like, and not ashamed to ask or put it out there
Earl
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By Ascensi - 5 Years Ago
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@Peter (RL) Could you please look into the new SSS shader compatibility if it will allow opacity and if opacity is added, will Iray now work with opacity using Iray's own SSS mode? Iray currently can't do opacity while using SSS and this was said to be because of iClone's shaders. If opacity works with iClone SSS and Iray then hopefully I can create assets that look a little more real like making the sunlight pass through and become absorbed by the waves, this will only work with opacity -other Iray shaders (Volumetric for example) don't offer the ability to use/manipulate existing textures applied to the model but instead replace them.
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By pwnz7321 - 5 Years Ago
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Honestly a bit disappointed with what has been shown with iclone8. I expected Real Time Raytracing and a visual quality that was similar to UE4. Will the ray tracing plugin at lease be updated to take advantage of rtx cards? Also will you update Iclone8 to allow us to use ray tracing compatible special effects without having to input them through a 2nd program? I feel like not moving to ray tracing photo realism is a major mistake.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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pwnz7321 (4/24/2020)
Honestly a bit disappointed with what has been shown with iclone8. I expected Real Time Raytracing and a visual quality that was similar to UE4. Will the ray tracing plugin at lease be updated to take advantage of rtx cards? Also will you update Iclone8 to allow us to use ray tracing compatible special effects without having to input them through a 2nd program? I feel like not moving to ray tracing photo realism is a major mistake.
I think that the merits of photo-realism for animation are overblown actually as it requires hyper-realism of everything or you end up in uncanny valley territory.
I agree that Iray could be shown some love, but I find improvements of the native renderer more important.
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By AlbinosGambit - 5 Years Ago
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I really hope Reallusion would also attend to their pricing system. I feel both software and content are far too highly-priced.
I would also love to see a facial animation without having an iPhone because there are so many cameras out there that can track depth. It costs a small fortune to actually get a facial and full-body mocap, so much software, and plugins but also buying an iPhone and a Mocap suit, at the moment to steep prices right now, it doesn't help with the COVID situation either.
DAZ Studio is actually coming out with a new Face Mocap, FACEMOJO, and will be way cheaper than the iClone version. On YouTube, they say it will be under $100. That's $299 less than iClone's version not counting other software you'll need there
RL has a 50% off software right now, but still, prices are steep :(
Also, I hope to see a better locomotion system implemented, many have been hoping for this for a long long time.
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By AutoDidact - 5 Years Ago
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AlbinosGambit (4/24/2020)
I really hope Reallusion would also attend to their pricing system. I feel both software and content are far too highly-priced.
I would also love to see a facial animation without having an iPhone because there are so many cameras out there that can track depth. It costs a small fortune to actually get a facial and full-body mocap, so much software, and plugins but also buying an iPhone and a Mocap suit, at the moment to steep prices right now, it doesn't help with the COVID situation either.
DAZ Studio is actually coming out with a new Face Mocap, FACEMOJO, and will be way cheaper than the iClone version. On YouTube, they say it will be under $100. That's $299 less than iClone's version not counting other software you'll need there
RL has a 50% off software right now, but still, prices are steep :(
Also, I hope to see a better locomotion system implemented, many have been hoping for this for a long long time.
For clarification the new facial mocap system is not from Daz, but an unaffiliated third party plugin maker and it also requires an Iphone and only supports one generation of Daz figure (G8).
Even at $100 USD, I personally doubt you will see many Daz users buying it as they are are largely still portrait/pin up girl artists not character animators/filmmakers.😌
Even those who ,might buy it ,are faced with a software that has no functional IK foot/floor solver. and an outdated rubbish version of the "3Dlight" render engine and the uber slow brute force path tracer from NVIDIA. ( Iray)🙄
Unless there are willing to export to a real time engine Like EEVEE or UE4/Unity and all that entails.
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By pwnz7321 - 5 Years Ago
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If this were just an update to iclone7 I would agree about them just improving the native render but since this is going to be Iclone8 and a full purchase it should be a complete redesign of the real time render to be up to par with the next generation of renderers which means a real time raytracing renderer. If they are just improving iclone7 and its renderer it should be a free update IE: Iclone7.95 or whatever.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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AlbinosGambit (4/24/2020)
I really hope Reallusion would also attend to their pricing system. I feel both software and content are far too highly-priced.
I would also love to see a facial animation without having an iPhone because there are so many cameras out there that can track depth. It costs a small fortune to actually get a facial and full-body mocap, so much software, and plugins but also buying an iPhone and a Mocap suit, at the moment to steep prices right now, it doesn't help with the COVID situation either.
DAZ Studio is actually coming out with a new Face Mocap, FACEMOJO, and will be way cheaper than the iClone version. On YouTube, they say it will be under $100. That's $299 less than iClone's version not counting other software you'll need there
RL has a 50% off software right now, but still, prices are steep :(
Also, I hope to see a better locomotion system implemented, many have been hoping for this for a long long time.
The price of body Mocap which involves suits and sensors is not controlled by RL. Solutions without a suit (such as the failed Kinect) are simply not realistic.
For facial animation iPhone is simply the best available solution. There may be an Android version, but I think that should be developed by a third party, not by RL. The iPhone includes a lot of intelligent processing. You can't just take a web cam and slap some software on it. Quality software is costly. I have Faceware, which uses a regular webcam, but the software is expensive, such that an iPhone solution is actually cheaper.
As I have mentioned before, RL wisely stays out of Mocap development other than providing the interface.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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pwnz7321 (4/25/2020)
If this were just an update to iclone7 I would agree about them just improving the native render but since this is going to be Iclone8 and a full purchase it should be a complete redesign of the real time render to be up to par with the next generation of renderers which means a real time raytracing renderer. If they are just improving iclone7 and its renderer it should be a free update IE: Iclone7.95 or whatever.
People are incredibly spoiled. You already get a lot of improvements for free during a major version development cycle, where other companies present you was a hefty monthly bill and if you don't pay your software becomes inoperable.
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By mick voyager - 5 Years Ago
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About the planned improved lipsync for release 7.9 in Q3 2020: How would that relate to the current iPhone face motion capture? Would that improve the accuracy of iPhone Live Motion as well, or is that a completely different workflow.
BTW, in the roadmap we are still missing this: Kinect body capture at the same time as iPhone Facial capture. When will this finally be possible? Can Kinect be added to the same Live Motion platform created for the expensive body capture suits?
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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mick voyager (4/27/2020)
About the planned improved lipsync for release 7.9 in Q3 2020: How would that relate to the current iPhone face motion capture? Would that improve the accuracy of iPhone Live Motion as well, or is that a completely different workflow.
It is a different workflow in the sense that the lip-sync function uses the audio speech file and creates visemes (lip/jaw positions) on the basis of that. The iPhone "reads" those lip/jaw positions via it's camera and doesn't use the audio as far as I know.
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By AlbinosGambit - 5 Years Ago
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Hi.
I know RL isn´t responsible for the mocap suit prices, that's not what I meant. I was talking more about the prices of the software, plugins, and content prices from RL, they are way to high compared to other similar solutions for 3D software. I wish it could be more like DAZ´s pricing system.
So besides iPhone for facial animation, there are no other just as good solutions out there? Really?
animagic (4/25/2020)
AlbinosGambit (4/24/2020)
I really hope Reallusion would also attend to their pricing system. I feel both software and content are far too highly-priced.
I would also love to see a facial animation without having an iPhone because there are so many cameras out there that can track depth. It costs a small fortune to actually get a facial and full-body mocap, so much software, and plugins but also buying an iPhone and a Mocap suit, at the moment to steep prices right now, it doesn't help with the COVID situation either.
DAZ Studio is actually coming out with a new Face Mocap, FACEMOJO, and will be way cheaper than the iClone version. On YouTube, they say it will be under $100. That's $299 less than iClone's version not counting other software you'll need there
RL has a 50% off software right now, but still, prices are steep :(
Also, I hope to see a better locomotion system implemented, many have been hoping for this for a long long time.
The price of body Mocap which involves suits and sensors is not controlled by RL. Solutions without a suit (such as the failed Kinect) are simply not realistic. For facial animation iPhone is simply the best available solution. There may be an Android version, but I think that should be developed by a third party, not by RL. The iPhone includes a lot of intelligent processing. You can't just take a web cam and slap some software on it. Quality software is costly. I have Faceware, which uses a regular webcam, but the software is expensive, such that an iPhone solution is actually cheaper. As I have mentioned before, RL wisely stays out of Mocap development other than providing the interface.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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We have had numerous discussions about prices in the past, and it is not that each RL employee is a Ferrari-driving millionaire. But they do have to get paid. Software development is expensive, there is no way around it. I want RL to stay in business and remain independent. Smaller 3D animation companies that had fine products have failed in the past and I don't want to go RL that same route.
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By MIDI3D - 5 Years Ago
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Speaking of which (To Animagic), I would be willing to pay RL and/or a python script developer a reasonable price for a script that allows for the import of Alembic files. I know that you and a couple of other brainiacs figured it out a few months back. Someone mentioned that they would develop a script shortly for the rest of us. Do you have any updated info on that? I was really impressed with the combined efforts of yourself and others to tackle that. Unfortunately for me, I will have to wait until one of you writes a script for me to be able to take advantage of it. Thanks in advance! :)
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By Peter (RL) - 5 Years Ago
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mick voyager (4/27/2020)
BTW, in the roadmap we are still missing this: Kinect body capture at the same time as iPhone Facial capture. When will this finally be possible? Can Kinect be added to the same Live Motion platform created for the expensive body capture suits?
Unfortunately the Kinect hardware has long been discontinued by Microsoft so further development of this technology is unlikely. There is little incentive in developing a gear profile for Motion LIVE 3D when the hardware can only be purchased second hand from places like Ebay.
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By mick voyager - 5 Years Ago
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Peter (RL) (4/29/2020)
mick voyager (4/27/2020)
BTW, in the roadmap we are still missing this: Kinect body capture at the same time as iPhone Facial capture. When will this finally be possible? Can Kinect be added to the same Live Motion platform created for the expensive body capture suits?Unfortunately the Kinect hardware has long been discontinued by Microsoft so further development of this technology is unlikely. There is little incentive in developing a gear profile for Motion LIVE 3D when the hardware can only be purchased second hand from places like Ebay.
Understood. What about all the other depth cameras that are widely available, or even the iPhone to use body capture (there are apps that already do this)? Or possibly high quality RGB webcams like the Logitech C922 for example that Brekel and IPIsoft are using for their motion capture?
Will RL consider to utilize hardware that is current and available for body motion capture?
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By new-own - 5 Years Ago
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Please improve the facial iPhone MoCap Plugin. Lips accuracy, more blend motions, auto wrinkles when smiling, forehead lines when raising eyebrows... etc. (even if we can custom make them)
Also, a dream come true if you make a Live plugin for Blender to send characters with live Mocap there.
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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I usually can see things well, but I am going to be honest - I cannot see any difference between the non-TAA and with TAA.
What exactly is the TAA supposed to be doing?
Because could you imagine going up to a person on the street and saying "what are the differences between these 2 clips?" and they would say, "I see XYZ"....what is that "XYZ" that they should be seeing.
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By 3DChick - 5 Years Ago
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I usually can see things well, but I am going to be honest - I cannot see any difference between the non-TAA and with TAA.
What exactly is the TAA supposed to be doing?
Because could you imagine going up to a person on the street and saying "what are the differences between these 2 clips?" and they would say, "I see XYZ"....what is that "XYZ" that they should be seeing.
:-D
I feel this way about Super Sampling. I've tried rendering the same scene with everything maxed out without Super Sampling on and with Super Sampling on, and other than a slight brightness of certain glows, I see no difference (except the crazy-long render time). I've asked friends and they can't see it, either.
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By Ascensi - 5 Years Ago
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1. Alembic Import Support 25+ votes for iClone 8
Reallusion could we expect Alembic import for iClone 8?
2.I'd also like to see Dynamic Caching/streaming with Occlusion culling of all props and characters if possible just to be able to have massive scenes created/loaded
3. and the ability to merge UVs as one on selected group of props.
4. Screen space colliders? (maybe most suitable for particles)
All these above changes should lower the performance impact and allow iClone to have some pretty impressive scenes.
5. Vertex shader for Softbody Physics with vertex weight paint tools (for CC3 & iClone) I'd love to see giant fleshy characters and props that have realistic movement when forces are used.
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By Rottadamic - 5 Years Ago
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What I like to know is, when can we expect iClone 8?
Early 2021?, ore late 2021?
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By davidmaximo - 5 Years Ago
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It would be cool if you could keyframe bones scaling or scale the avatars so they can grow huge or shrink in camera
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By justaviking - 5 Years Ago
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davidmaximo (5/27/2020)
It would be cool if you could keyframe bones scaling or scale the avatars so they can grow huge or shrink in camera
I remember a loooong time ago there was a RL video (probably announcing new features) that showed a cat jumping, and they "stretched" the cat when in mid-air to make it look longer while jumping. So I'm sure that was keyframed, but I don't remember how they did it.
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By Ascensi - 5 Years Ago
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@Reallusion I because your aiming for more realism I think it would be keen to include Fresnel! we need some advanced optics to be able to create lensing effects, add that to water, glass and optionally to character's vision like wearing glasses.
Maybe this be created with a special hidden camera that only sees/renders the object that has Fresnel added and changes the focal length and angle of view and that gets passed to the main camera in use? I'm sure it's more complicated than that so here is some info https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fresnel_equations
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By Peter_914185 - 5 Years Ago
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Could you please add the ability to live stream footage into Iclone!
Yes UE4 can do it but UE4 is definitely not user friendly and trying to get a material to work as a shadow catcher seems to be impossible. There is a massive market in live streaming and if Reallusion can corner that market and allow people to comp themselves along side animated characters I'm pretty sure Iclone sales will jump. Plus out of all the request I've read on here, surely this is one of the simplest to implement requiring just a URL live stream input that could then be applied in the same way normal video is at the moment?
I've just created a post regarding this feature but it's probably more appropriate here.
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By 0oseven - 5 Years Ago
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The Text to speech is a fantastic feature in iclone as animators usually want to add dialogue but getting a voice over for a script is really hard. Just wondering if in upcoming 7.9 the revision to lipsync and visemes might include a bigger variety of voice options [ male /female - accents etc ] ? Would be really useful if there was an improved library of voices built into IClone .
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By 0oseven - 5 Years Ago
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I would like to see option to split screen at least two - maybe four views . The mini viewport is not the best idea.
Access to different views via icon selection on toolbar is a quick way to switch.
Also maybe better colour for the camera wire frame so it shows up better.
I come from Daz Carrara8.5 which has great camera controls. Perhaps you could take a look and emulate.
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By kungphu - 5 Years Ago
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I’m probs way in the minority here, but this item always ends up frustrating me at some point. With camera switcher it’s rather difficult to understand which cam is actually chosen. You have to hover just exactly over the switch for it to reveal what camera it is. Why can’t we get a solid thick rectangle with text like we do on motion/visme tracks etc. Seems like an easy fix. I’ve usually got a ton of camera cuts in a scene, editing and arranging them can be such a time consuming pain just because it take so long just to figure out what camera I used at a particular point in time. For précis it’s a nice reference as well to say oh at such and such a time we switch from a wide shot to a medium 2shot. Easy stuff like that isn’t intuitive if you can’t tell what the shots are by simply looking at the screen. Again, you have to hover exactly in the right place.
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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0oseven (6/17/2020)
The Text to speech is a fantastic feature in iclone as animators usually want to add dialogue but getting a voice over for a script is really hard. Just wondering if in upcoming 7.9 the revision to lipsync and visemes might include a bigger variety of voice options [ male /female - accents etc ] ? Would be really useful if there was an improved library of voices built into IClone .
iClone does not come with voices. The available voices depend on what is installed on your PC. There are additional free Microsoft voices you can use, but it requires some registry editing.
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By dogged2003 - 5 Years Ago
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I had problems. I have not been to the forum for a long time. I go to the forum. Maybe it's time to solve these issues:
https://forum.reallusion.com/448048/Sliding-in-between-keyframes
https://forum.reallusion.com/441998/How-can-I-better-control-root-transform-movement
;)
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By animagic - 5 Years Ago
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Suggestions have been given. Maybe try those...:P
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By pka4916 - 5 Years Ago
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Will Mirror effect be included in 7.8 ? or is that only in V 8?
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By StyleMarshal - 5 Years Ago
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V8 :-)
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By toystorylab - 5 Years Ago
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kungphu (6/17/2020)
I’m probs way in the minority here, but this item always ends up frustrating me at some point.
With camera switcher it’s rather difficult to understand which cam is actually chosen.
You have to hover just exactly over the switch for it to reveal what camera it is.
Yeah, that's really annoying.
BUT that was not the case in earlier versions of iClone.
You could simply hover over the switcher "line" and it showed the camera on that spot,
no need to go back to the exact switching point.
@RL please make that work again as it once (can't exactly say at what point of version that changed) was!
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By oisilener1982 - 5 Years Ago
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I know that 7.8 havent been released yet but im really exited about Enhanced Facial lip sync in 7.9
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By Andrés Moya - 5 Years Ago
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A lot of demands around here. It must be hard for RL to please everybody (I must say impossible at this point) and patience is a virtue. I've also been waiting alooooong time for an enhance of the native renderer, but we all have different taste and needs (sculpting, animation, filmmaking...) and speeding up things in software development doesn't solve anything, but outcomes a buggy product, and I'm sure that's something we don't want. This was just a fast preview of some things that are coming, so we can freely expect more. Patience people, we are almost there!!
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By simon_20140205222146880 - 5 Years Ago
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My main wishes would be aimed more at larger scale productivity rather than new fancy features..eg:- Being able to group/organize objects in some kind of hierarchy/layers like all other programs known to man. (eg right click on the scene view and add new folders/sub folders) I know there is a plugin for this but its a bit clunky and iclone still has issues selecting many objects at the same time.
- As mentioned above I'd like to see MUCH faster edit rendering speeds when selecting lots of objects (200 + objects is un-workable at the moment). Maybe some kind of instancing for objects rather than just for their shared materials would speed things up?!?
- Scenes of more than 15 minutes - and that can actually run at a good fps! :) Failing that- some kind of scene system which I can move between quickly.
Cheers :)
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By Procrastinator - 5 Years Ago
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i hope for an instant LOD function (similar to unreal) where the characters would automatically be assigned with the LOD that they are supposed to be using in terms of the view distance. Not all things are one inch away.
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By Data Juggler - 5 Years Ago
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Procrastinator (8/24/2020)
i hope for an instant LOD function (similar to unreal) where the characters would automatically be assigned with the LOD that they are supposed to be using in terms of the view distance. Not all things are one inch away.
My 'What I learned today': LOD - Level of Detail.
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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Hi Reallusion!
Do you have some WIP for the new enhanced lypsinc , in french in my case, to show ?
will this update come this month as is announced in the first post of this thread ?
Thank you for your answer
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By AniMajik - 5 Years Ago
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RE: Enhanced Lipsync - I would love to see any demo of the new lipsync as well. Perhaps a side-by-side comparison between the current version and the new. ;)
-AniMajik
The Stellar Command
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By 0oseven - 5 Years Ago
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Since posting this 3 months ago I have to say that the view port is still a major issue for me.
Setting up scenes and shifting objects around including lights and cameras and characters is so hard in Iclone.
Adding several cameras and continual switching from one to another is not the same as four views on screen at the same time.
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By oisilener1982 - 5 Years Ago
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Any estimated date when will iClone 7.9 be released?
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By Auroratrek - 5 Years Ago
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Any chance the lip sync visemes (as well as facial expressions) will be editable in the Curve editor?
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By Nick GlassB - 5 Years Ago
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Any word on v7.9? Looking forward to that enhanced viseme on a number of projects...
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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I don't think we'll see anything until the CC contest ends on November 18th.
It seems to conflict with the participants who would have already submitted their creation without having access to the dynamic wrinkles and the new lypsync.
This is what seems the most logical.
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By Nick GlassB - 5 Years Ago
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I had a ticket raised with Reallusion and while exchanging messages with the support team I asked and they confirmed 7.9 will be released at the end of Q4 so bit of a wait yet!
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By mtakerkart - 5 Years Ago
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Oh! I didn't expect it to be this far ....
Thank you
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By gordryd - 5 Years Ago
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Will iClone 8 support AMD graphics cards? Now that "Big Navi" can compete/exceed against RTX 3080/90 it would be nice to have the option...
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By serhan_83 - 5 Years Ago
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yes I wonder that too. Honestly I don't want to pay too muchfor high memory ram...
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By magikshow - 5 Years Ago
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when will iclone 7.9 be released?
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By Nick GlassB - 5 Years Ago
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I think we are all waiting on this one! Seen nothing more since RL told me end of Q4...
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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I would like to see a slimmer content menu system. Half the time I click on a folder or load an animation or prop through the menu system, iClone just gives me a spinning loading wheel and then goes unresponsive.
I have to use Find File as a workaround to load items as iClone's own menu system leads to application hangs..
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By TonyDPrime - 5 Years Ago
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I would like to see a slimmer content menu system. Half the time I click on a folder or load an animation or prop through the menu system, iClone just gives me a spinning loading wheel and then goes unresponsive.
I have to use Find File as a workaround to load items as iClone's own menu system leads to application hangs..
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By HooDooPhonix - 4 Years Ago
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Has anyone heard about 7.9? I am waiting on my production to come out, and dont know if its worth waiting for or not.
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By Data Juggler - 4 Years Ago
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Yes, I have heard about it.
The title of this post should now be: 'What we didn't finish in 2020, but will try for 2021'.
Last I heard was 7.9 was scheduled for end of last quarter/year.
I wish there were weekly news updates, or bi-monthly just so everyone isn't kept guessing.
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By ClemG - 4 Years Ago
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Reallusion's Marketing Director recently suggested Januray 2021 on Linkedin when I ask whether Santa would bring 7.9 for Christmas...
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/enoc-burgos-2049253_reallusion-ugcPost-6747310610595352576-ecpx
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By Data Juggler - 4 Years Ago
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Apparently Santa is still in the checking his list twice business. Better later than buggy.
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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I feel everyone's pain! I'm holding off on certain bits of production in the hope the new lipsync will really speed up my work flow so I've held off from starting things the manual way. Getting a bit annoying now I must say. We've been in lockdown so I can't imagine whats been holding up progress.
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By animagic - 4 Years Ago
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nick_glassborow (1/6/2021)
I feel everyone's pain! I'm holding off on certain bits of production in the hope the new lipsync will really speed up my work flow so I've held off from starting things the manual way. Getting a bit annoying now I must say. We've been in lockdown so I can't imagine whats been holding up progress.
Testing?...:ermm::blink::w00t:
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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It was originally penciled in for Q3 i believe so thats quite the extended testing schedule so no doubt it will be completely bug free...
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By tomautobahn - 4 Years Ago
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Will the new lipsync support realtime? Or is it something we'll have to add after recording, like the existing lipsync workflow
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By Data Juggler - 4 Years Ago
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Can you start a new thread for this, since the title is so last year?
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By sg1caprica - 4 Years Ago
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Does anybody know when Enhanced Facial Lip-sync (iClone 7.9) will be available?
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By Data Juggler - 4 Years Ago
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I understand software delays, and I would rather a fully tested and working version, but put out weekly or bi-monthly announcements as to the progress.
Worse case, once a month tell us what is happening.
Why the secrecy?
The lack of communication from Reallusion is what is annoying.
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By animagic - 4 Years Ago
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I will tell you why. At some point RL was more forthcoming with due dates and the like and that backfired whenever a date was not met or a feature could not be implement. So they have become more cautious.
Most users are not software developers and have no understanding why things are delayed.
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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On that basis it might have been a mistake to set peoples expectations by publishing a time line on their road map. I think that's what started everyone's hopes and expectations. Still from what Enoc Burgos told me not too long ago the release should be available to us any time now.
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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Perhaps there was a typo in the year on the road map...
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By Peter (RL) - 4 Years Ago
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nick_glassborow (2/11/2021)
On that basis it might have been a mistake to set peoples expectations by publishing a time line on their road map. I think that's what started everyone's hopes and expectations. Still from what Enoc Burgos told me not too long ago the release should be available to us any time now.
When you publish a roadmap for the year ahead it is impossible to know if there will be delays 8-10 months later. For example who would have foreseen a global pandemic of these proportions a year ago.
Sadly delays have happened for virtually all software and hardware companies this year but I can assure you the 3D team is working flat out to get the new updates to you as soon as possible.
While there isn't a finalised date yet the approximate time frame is now mid March.
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By pwnz7321 - 4 Years Ago
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Mid March for the Next Software Update or the New Road Map or Both?
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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It is a fair comment with regard to unforeseen circumstances etc. It just comes down to managing expectations though. I was told recently it would be a few weeks and this release is particularly key for may of us. I personally have put several projects on hold in the hope that the enhanced lip sync will save me a bit of time. Had I had a better idea of what sort of time frame we were looking at I could have planned around it easier. Perhaps an update email of notice on the website just to keep us informed.
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By JCL1 - 4 Years Ago
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I see this timeframe issue across every industry I've worked in. In my encounters, from both the user and developer end including software, I've never experienced a project that came out on time.
It's unfortunately a lose lose... people get upset if there is no timeline estimation/updates, and they get upset if an update announces something is late. So of course, the question is, why not give an accurate estimation?
There's various other reasons for bad estimations. Undue pressure/expectations from management/funders, sometimes they flat out reject your initial timeline proposal because the budget won't work that way. Other times, it's simply hard to create an accurate projection, even if you add a ton of safety margin to it. I mean, imagine if you're a programmer and you're tasked with creating a hair generation module that you've never done before, and management is ordering you to make a "best guess" estimate, how would you do it?
Finally, the concept of time is so different from perspective. Being on both sides of it, even 6 months goes by in a blink of an eye when you're a developer frantically working. For it user, this seems like an eternity...
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By Data Juggler - 4 Years Ago
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I agree with that timelines. Most of the time the timeline is how long they want it to take, and the best sales people are dishonest, that is what I suck at sales.
People ask me and I come up with my estimate, then triple it.
Most projects wouldn't get started if management knew it was an extra year and twice the budget, so they start and get to the 60% line and have to decide to keep going or write off all the investment already poured in.
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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I'm a project Manager in my day job - sure projects are often late for reasons usually beyond anyone's control. In all my years the thing I have seen result in the most frequent stakeholder dissatisfaction is poorly managed expectations. It is a particular problem with software developers in my experience. An unfortunate consequence of trying to schedule past the planning horizon is always going to be missed deadlines. Keeping stakeholders informed is always going to avoid frustrations along the way as opposed to radio silence and frustration at being chased.
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By JCL1 - 4 Years Ago
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You guys hit it right on the head, some projects don't even see the light of day if we go by the estimates of the people who work in the trenches. It's this underlying truth that everyone knows, yet it still happens and it happens everywhere. It's like it's done this way to 'work the system'.
I'll also add that the annual/quarterly earnings cycle doesn't help either. It makes it very difficult to commission multiyear projects when shareholders demand results year over year.
And yeah, don't get me started on sales... where everything is based on commissions but there is no dis-incentive for over-promising...
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By animagic - 4 Years Ago
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I used to create project schedules and I had an understanding how long things would take and plan accordingly and have a release in April, for example.
Then management said we needed a release in February. So I would create a schedule claiming a release in February. Of course there were delays and the release was in April...:P
"Those who know are seldom in control."
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By Nick GlassB - 4 Years Ago
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animagic (2/22/2021)
I used to create project schedules and I had an understanding how long things would take and plan accordingly and have a release in April, for example.
Then management said we needed a release in February. So I would create a schedule claiming a release in February. Of course there were delays and the release was in April...:P
"Those who know are seldom in control."
That's part of the territory. Difference is if I say April and they want February I then ask which element of the quality are they prepared to sacrifice - they soon come around to my way of thinking. As for developers; I work on the 1 to 3 rule (If they tell me a month I tell everyone else 3 months ;-)
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By JCL1 - 4 Years Ago
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There's also this, if you submit what you believe to be a realistic timeline, and the project is late, then you're in big trouble.
It's almost better strategically to be late under unrealistic expectations...
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By Peter (RL) - 4 Years Ago
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pwnz7321 (2/22/2021)
Mid March for the Next Software Update or the New Road Map or Both?
Mid March is the approximate time frame for the iClone 7.9 and Character Creator 3.4 updates.
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By Amper Sand - 4 Years Ago
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Peter (RL) (2/22/2021)Mid March is the approximate time frame for the iClone 7.9 and Character Creator 3.4 updates.
Hi Peter
It's still valid this ETA?
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