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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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A while back I posted a quick poll, and although surprising to some, the results did have a strong (not majority) leaning towards movie making and the like. https://forum.reallusion.com/316275/Would-you-like-to-see-a-directtoGameengine-export-in-CC2-or-Pipeline - now I know the question is partially moot, but I adjusted it slightly in order to see how people are looking forward (or not) to the new CC3.
As I look back on my old posts, I decided to just have a poke around and see how people still feel about the topic. Being primarily Unreal-self-taught most of my reasoning will come from there...
1. The Unreal Engine has made massive strides in its own movie-making capabilities...so much so that rewind/forward is nothing but being able to completely re-angle a camera shot without having to set up a new camera...love it.
2. Epic have made a concerted effort to include as many professional film/movie camera profies as they can. Post-production is built into the system, and obviously green-screen is in there as well.
3. My favourite - the newest technologies (read them up if you're not aware) allow for such things as LIVE RENDERING OF IRAY. Granted this make take some significant computing power, but I'll be the first to say I'm going for the Geforce RTX 2080Ti. Even without such a device, it shows that movie making with realistic figures is becoming a possibility.
4. The 'Serkis / Cumberbatch Argument' - if you're willing to create a character (hello CC3!), do the correct mapping and then use the right tools within iClone's suite or, perhaps more developed - the Unreal Engine you can create phenomenally accurate speaking, behaving, expression and animation, and given the massive library of motions out there, you could blend those in to make it more real.
I'm sure there's more, but my pills are kicking in and I'm tired. Best to all!
Paul C
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By akuei2 - 6 Years Ago
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IMHO, CC3 is great pipeline import 3d party stuff (especially outfit or morph ) to C3 character. In other words, C3 character can only operate well in RL app's environment such: bend corrective, material optimum & so-on.
So, I don't think C3 character can do well at 3rd party environment as in Iclone.
For budget user who's motion graffic or hobby's movie creation, better bending stronger with Iclone.
What I thought ...
If RL can enhance Iclone import function ( support alembic, point could ), and improve realtime render quality ( SSS, customize shader ).
All will be the best result.
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By animagic - 6 Years Ago
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@Atonnis: I've probably answered previously that I'm mainly into moviemaking the last time, so this time I didn't respond.
The way I see it, the options are not necessarily exclusive of each other. I may not care about exporting to games, but I'm not against it even though making movies is my thing.
My understanding is that CC3 as stand-alone product (the Pipeline) is no longer exclusively for iClone, as there are functions (such as LOD) for game optimization. So I would think that CC3 characters are definitely suitable for games.
So my question to you is, other than FBX export what else do you need?
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By sonic7 - 6 Years Ago
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Similar to Ani above (though haven't voted before) ....
For this I went with ●3 - though I equally agree with ●4
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By mr_vidius - 6 Years Ago
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animagic (9/16/2018)
@Atonnis: I've probably answered previously that I'm mainly into moviemaking the last time, so this time I didn't respond.
The way I see it, the options are not necessarily exclusive of each other. I may not care about exporting to games, but I'm not against it even though making movies is my thing.
My understanding is that CC3 as stand-alone product (the Pipeline) is no longer exclusively for iClone, as there are functions (such as LOD) for game optimization. So I would think that CC3 characters are definitely suitable for games.
So my question to you is, other than FBX export what else do you need?
What else do I need? well... it would be really nice if I could export those CC3 characters into the real world. Then I could have a better class of friends
to hang out with.  Maybe RL could make that happen when they create an update to CC3.
vidius
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By gerdich - 6 Years Ago
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I would prefere a freely redistributable interactive model viewer: An API that I can integrate in my Delphi (or Visual Studio) applications and run on Windows, OSX, Android and iOS.
iClone and Game engines have different features. If you translate you lose. And there is much trouble with the different file formats.
Game engines are for very special applications. Today with VR there are much more use cases. Much of them don't need all the complexity of a game.
There should be a Reallusion component that I can paste on my Delphi form which allows me to represent an iClone Scene in its own way, with a rich access to the features Reallusion has implemented.
No file conversion, but an organic viewer. That is what I am searching for.
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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mr_vidius(9/16/2018)
animagic (9/16/2018)
@Atonnis: I've probably answered previously that I'm mainly into moviemaking the last time, so this time I didn't respond.
The way I see it, the options are not necessarily exclusive of each other. I may not care about exporting to games, but I'm not against it even though making movies is my thing.
My understanding is that CC3 as stand-alone product (the Pipeline) is no longer exclusively for iClone, as there are functions (such as LOD) for game optimization. So I would think that CC3 characters are definitely suitable for games.
So my question to you is, other than FBX export what else do you need?
What else do I need? well... it would be really nice if I could export those CC3 characters into the real world. Then I could have a better class of friends to hang out with. Maybe RL could make that happen when they create an update to CC3.vidius
Given that importing DAZ characters and their outfits will be distinctly easier, I think all we need now is some kind of 'Weird Science' device and I'll end up being a sad old disabled pervert stuck at his computer wishing he could actually do something about it. Sigh...
My next project is to make the most realistic-looking TV series I can using iClone CC3 and the Unreal Engine. I've been screenwriting and dialoguing an adaptation of the Death Gate Series by Margaret Weiss and Tracy Hickman. I always thought it would make a fantastic TV show (perhaps a bit much for movies - but may be not...?) I want to see if I can push the boundaries of TV shows past the uncanny valley - or at least so far deep into it that everyone gets used to living there - plus I have some d*mn good moments already designed. I'll need a lot of motion captured dancers though.
Anyway, I digress. I just wanted to see how peoples' views might've changed.
Also, in short: I'd LOVE to see some of these iclone creations some of you have made. My body may be slowly failing me, but my mind would love to experience more.
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By sonic7 - 6 Years Ago
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Sent you a PM .....
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By animagic - 6 Years Ago
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Atonnis (9/16/2018)
Also, in short: I'd LOVE to see some of these iclone creations some of you have made. My body may be slowly failing me, but my mind would love to experience more.
If interested, check out my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/zuijlen. This link is also in my signature, as is a link to my website.
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By Snarp Farkle - 6 Years Ago
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This is not an easy question for me to answer because eleven years ago when I first decided to get involved with animation I was more or less wanting to learn how to make a game, but having the ability to tell a story with animation also intrigued me and that's what was, and is, happening in the gaming industry even now.
But unfortunately at the time the costs in both time and money were way out of reach for me then to actively get involved. A couple years later I ran into a trial version of iClone 3, just one of the many animation programs I was investigating back then, and I saw that with iClone I actually could learn this stuff! But again the costs were just too high. Then iClone 4 came out and I saw all the improvements and ease of use, more of less, and decided that when I was able to afford to invest in an animation program that Reallusion was the company I would get involved with because I liked their view of the future of 3D animation. I now have iClone 5,6 & 7, CrazyTalk 5,6,7 & 8, CrazyTalkAnimator 2 & 3, 3dXchange 5, 6 & 7 Pipeline, PopVideo, and most of the other plugins.
There's still room for improvement in Reallusion products, I still don't have the ability to have facial hair move with expressions or speech or a long beard blowing in the wind for example. 
To make a very long story short... I guess I'm still looking into making either a game with movies or a movie that turns into a game and that's because I have four boys and nine grandchildren that have been more or less born into the gaming era and, like it or not, it's where they are learning... or should I say being influenced by strangers, how to make some important choices that may affect how they will react to real world situations.
Games shouldn't be only about how to be the best at killing people, or how to be a better thief or bully, as I see in a lot of the games out there now. I think it's the feeling of accomplishment in a virtual world that kids just can't get in the real world that keeps them hooked, and if I can learn to create something that will help my grandchildren with their faces on an avatar, learn real world lessons via a virtual world game with movies on a shoestring budget, CC3 is a tool that I will need and am excited to get into it!
Besides, should a zombie apocalypse or a living in space type scenario actually occur in their lifetime, then they will already have the mindset skills in place to maybe survive it and help keep things from eating my brain too! 
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By Kelleytoons - 6 Years Ago
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I like the way you think, Mr. F. I wish you the best in your quest to design such a game.
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By Snarp Farkle - 6 Years Ago
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Kelleytoons (9/16/2018)
I like the way you think, Mr. F. I wish you the best in your quest to design such a game.
Thank you Mike,
I know it's a big challenge but it's pretty much what I'm working towards. I've still got a lot to learn of course which I couldn't do without the help from all the wonderful people on this forum such as yourself, I've learned a great deal from you and appreciate you, just so you know! 
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By CtrlZ - 6 Years Ago
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@Atommis: My hope is to take these stories that I have in my head and bring them to life!
My first video is in my signature below
Gary
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By Kelleytoons - 6 Years Ago
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Well, thank you for the kind words, Mr. F. We all try and learn from each other -- ripples in a pond.
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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Hi Gary,
I was extremely impressed with the work done in your mini-movie. I especially loved the multiple change-of-genre/plotlines that made it so 'more-ish'.
I could quibble - but I'm a perfectionist sometimes. What I'd like to do is see some more of your work, if I may. Education is something that never ends, and I want to learn everything.
Just FYI - in case you hadn't seen it - here was the demo nvidia and Unreal did together (mostly Unreal) completely rendered in real-time, no pre-rendering AT ALL. The video is a mix of all their demos over the last year or so.
NO-ONE IN THIS VIDEO IS A HUMAN BEING - THEY ARE BASED AND VOICED ON HUMANS, BUT NO CHARACTER IS HUMAN...
UnrealEngineDemo
I hope to hear more of you soon.
Best
Paul
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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animagic(9/16/2018)
@Atonnis: I've probably answered previously that I'm mainly into moviemaking the last time, so this time I didn't respond.
The way I see it, the options are not necessarily exclusive of each other. I may not care about exporting to games, but I'm not against it even though making movies is my thing.
My understanding is that CC3 as stand-alone product (the Pipeline) is no longer exclusively for iClone, as there are functions (such as LOD) for game optimization. So I would think that CC3 characters are definitely suitable for games.
So my question to you is, other than FBX export what else do you need?
Hi animagic, I've seen your logo a thousand times so it's an honour to talk.
Epic has worked on the Unreal Engine during the last year or so improving their movie-creation capabilities...so much so that they've actually created a whole new system to replace the whole new system they had just already made.
Now they have improved their technology to include more on screen at once, lighting from a vast array of different light types, and even added a huge array of real-world cameras and the exact view and feel they give.in the real world, and giving such capabilities of filming an entire scene, but rather than just needing cameras set up everywhere and taking one or two shots of a scene, the whole scene can be locked, slow-mo'd, reversed, etc whilst the cameras are moved around the entire scene to get the exact scene the director and/or producer is looking for and those same cameras can be filtered or changed on the fly.
Really, have a look at the Unreal Engine for movie making, it's not difficult to use, and I'm on there all the time - and the community is excellent. You could create a fantastic blend between all these products.
Oh, and the Unreal Engine is free. It's only assets that cost, or if you sell your product they take a percentage after a certain amount has been made. Since most of your assets could be coming from Reallusion it wouldn't cost anything more from Unreal. Also, Unreal semi-regularly release free projects with no license fees for use of assets in your own projects. One not too long ago was a very realistic head.
Anyway, I tend to babble. Apologies. Have a great night, and I hope we all get to talk some more!
Paul
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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What else do I need? well... it would be really nice if I could export those CC3 characters into the real world. Then I could have a better class of friends to hang out with. Maybe RL could make that happen when they create an update to CC3.vidius
Somehow I'm imagining a full DAZ3D to CC3 creation facility, and then 3D printers capable of printing something akin to those RealDolls, ones that are biodegradable and break down after about an hour or two.
Either that or we need some sort of 'Weird Science' machine.
Oh dear....my line of thinking should really go elsewhere....
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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Hi Mr Farkle,
If you're still of a mind to create a video game with lots of video and interesting game mechanics, then I'd be delighted to talk to you. We could brainstorm under NDA (if you want protection for your ideas) and perhaps we could come up with a story that fits a game style that would suit us both.
Feel free to get in contact if you wish. I've spent a lot of time with the Unreal Engine so not only can I assist if you need help that way, but I need some education in Reallusion products (although I've been watching the tutorials like mad).
More importantly - I feel a game and a story should be as one, not everything in a game has to be explained, and not everything in a story has to be spelled out, but can be hinted or even made as a sort of sidequest in a game. There are so many types of game.
Anyway, I leave it up to you. All my best wishes.
Paul
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By Atonnis - 6 Years Ago
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Kelleytoons (9/16/2018)
Well, thank you for the kind words, Mr. F. We all try and learn from each other -- ripples in a pond.
And this guy is amongst the best, for helpfulness, friendliness and skill. I always take special note of what he has to say.
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