How do I setup a "Kinect for Windows" (not the Xbox Kinect) on windows 7?

How do I setup a "Kinect for Windows" (not the Xbox Kinect) on windows 7?

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By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Has anyone successfully set up a "Kinect for Windows" (not the Xbox Kinect) on windows 7?

I installed the Microsoft Kinect SDK V1 and the Kinect demo programs work fine, so the unit is working.

I tried both the mocap plug-in and mocap plug-in 1.1 which didn't work (not unexpected as they seem to be for the the Xbox version and might not work with the Microsoft Kinect SDK V1 anyway).

No other combination of plugins / drivers have worked either. Kinect SDK RC4 is mentioned, but I can't find it.

If anyone has a Kinect for Windows (not the xbox Kinect) working with a Reallision mocap plugin in windows 7, could you tell me how you did it?

Thanks!!!
Chris N

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

Hi Chris

Firstly let me just say the Mocap Device Plugin has absolutely nothing to do with the XBox 360. This is for PC only and no XBox is required.

By the sounds of it you have installed the wrong plugin/drivers.

So you need to first uninstall all the drivers you have installed so far so your system is clean. Restart your computer and then connect the Kinect device to your PC and power it up.

You then need to download the Microsoft Kinect SDK Beta version of the Mocap Device Plugin. You can find this in your Account. Just look for your Mocap Plugin in the list of Registered Programs and click Bonus. Then look in the Bonus downloads for the file.

Finally install the file you downloaded from your Account. This contains all the drivers and files needed for your Kinect device. Once completed you should be up and running. :)

By yaRincewind - 13 Years Ago

You two guys are sure that you're talking from the same thing?
There do exist two different Kinects.
For the XBox (everybody is using at the moment), ~100€
For Windows (brand new), ~250€

The main difference is the driver. The final SDK will not support the XBox Kinect, but only the Windows Kinect.
So Peter, are you sure that the Kinect for Windows is supported by the Beta SDK?

By animagic - 13 Years Ago

The confusion is the the Kinect that iClone needs can be used with the Xbox, but that the Xbox itself is not relevant in the setup. In fact, what you need is the so-called standalone Kinect, which comes with a power supply cable.

Windows Kinect is indeed a completely different animal.

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Peter, thanks for the quick response. Unfortunately, I have tried that plugin and SDK combination and it doesn't work.

I think there is some confusion here about the two different Kinect models, as yaRincewind has correctly pointed out:

The original one: "Kinect for xBox", and the new one that I have; "Kinect for Windows" model # 1517 ($250 direct from Microsoft).

According to the chart on the Reallision website at: http://www.reallusion.com/iclone/iclone_whatsnew_v51.aspx

The chart says that the Kinect SDK Beta2 is for the "Kinect for xBox" model (doesn't work) and Kinect SDK RC4 is for the "Kinect for Windows" (the one I have) running Win 7.

I'd love to try the Kinect SDK RC4 that's supposed to be for my model, but I can't find it anywhere; It's not in my member page either as a download or bonus, nor is it at the Microsoft Kinect for Windows site as they are no longer shipping betas or RC's, just the release SDK; V1.0 (which doesn't work with any of the Mocap plugins, either).

Interestingly, the page at the above URL shows a photo of the new Windows Kinect (they say KINECT on the face instead of xBox) and mentions the Kinect for Windows model specifically, but it doesn't seem to be supported by Reallision.

Is there still a way to get this Kinect to work? And where has the mysterious RC4 SDK gone?

By yaRincewind - 13 Years Ago

I don´t have such a device at hand at the moment.

The only thing you could hope is, that the Open Nite drivers will work with the Kinect for Windows. At least at the moment.

But these aren´t my last thoughts on this.

For the Kinect SDK for Windows (so, the final after the betas we are using at the moment) will drop down support fpr the Xbox Kinect, we will truly run into troubles!

1. Kinect for Windows doesn´t work with the RL-Plugin
2. The final MS SDK doesn´t support the Xbox SDK
3. No idea if the open ni drivers will support both Kinects (Xbox and Windows Kinect)

So, which way should RL go now?

The SDK Beta 2 will be removed sooner or later.

Dropping support for the Kinect Beta SDK:
Con:
1. Everyone who has already bought a Kinect for the Xbox, can now put in into Ebay.
2. Kinect for Windows is quite expensive. 250 <=> 100 €
Pro:
1. New SDK available (?new features?)
2. If new SDK will have features like facial recogintion in future, new SDK is needed (I think more likely a NEW Kinect will have this feature, with USB 3 and more depth resolution, making it possible to track fingers ets.)

Remaining Support for the Beta SDK:
Con:
1. Doesn´t work with Kinect for Windows (I don´t know if this can be implemented in the Plugin. Would mean, you have 3 different drivers you have to support)
2. The Kinect SDK Beta will vanish sooner or later, then the Xbox Kinect is useless for iClone
Pro:
1. Lots of people already do have this Kinect

To be true, I don´t have any idea which sollution is best.
The best would be, to support both Kinects with the SDK, but I don´t know if this is a practical way.

The second best would be, dropping down the support for the MS SDK completly, and concentrate on making the Open NI drivers better.

The third would be, making a deal with iPi. Would be expensive, and you would loose realtime features, but certainly get more quality out of mocap in generall.

Open NI with Brekel and Motionbuilder for example can deliver very good motions, including turning around etc.

Three thumbs up for MoCap, although I have no idea how we will continue.

By animagic - 13 Years Ago

I sincerily hope that the existing Xbox Kinect will stay supported. Mine is still unpacked, but I was going to use it in the near future. Facial recognition probably needs the newer Kinect.

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

chris_n (2/10/2012)

Hi Chris

Apologies for the initial confusion.

However my understanding (but not through testing) was that the Kinect For Windows sensor would work in the same way with the Mocap Device Plugin as the original Kinect or Primesense sensor did.

As you seem to be unable to get this to work I would advise you to contact Technical Support using the link below. There may be further complications than was originally thought that tech support will need to investigate.

http://www.reallusion.com/CustomerSupport/User/QForm.aspx

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

chris_n (2/10/2012)

I'd love to try the Kinect SDK RC4 that's supposed to be for my model, but I can't find it anywhere; It's not in my member page either as a download or bonus, nor is it at the Microsoft Kinect for Windows site as they are no longer shipping betas or RC's, just the release SDK; V1.0 (which doesn't work with any of the Mocap plugins, either).

Just to add that there is no SDK RC4 available yet from Reallusion. The Microsoft Kinect SDK Beta 2 is available from your Account as shown below. This contains the SDK Beta 2 files, drivers and Mocap Device Plugin in one installer. Have you tried installing this for your device?

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Yes, It didn't work.

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Also, I did email the address you suggested a while ago and have never hear anything back.

The fact is I don't think that the "Kinect for Windows" version of the Kinect works with Reallusion Mocap. Has ANYONE gotten one to work?

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

chris_n (2/10/2012)

Also, I did email the address you suggested a while ago and have never hear anything back.

If you used the Support form I linked to above then please check in your Account under Support Tickets to see any replies that have been made. Sometimes email replies get filtered as spam. Replies from Support are normally made within 2-3 working days.

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Peter,

Thanks, I did find the answer at Support Tickets: Wait for the update to iClone Pro V5.12!

OK, so the next version of the iClone Pro mocap will support Kinect for Windows. Now I know.

:D

By nigel - 13 Years Ago

I'm having the same problem, the new Kinect plug-in for Windows, fresh from my account, does not work but the beta version did.

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

nigel (2/14/2012)

I'm having the same problem, the new Kinect plug-in for Windows, fresh from my account, does not work but the beta version did.

Nigel do you have Kinect For Windows or the older Kinect Sensor that works with the XBox. The new Microsoft Kinect SDK in your account is for the newly released Kinect For Windows only. Those with older Kinects For XBox should continue to use the old Beta SDK.

By planetstardragon - 13 Years Ago

@peter, how do you tell the difference between older and newer ? I just got mine a few days ago, so I am 'assuming' it's a new version, but I'm using the beta, and the 1.1 version I have isn't working. Still confused if I have the 'best' set up installed. Should I uninstall the plug in and drivers and just install the 1.1 or leave the beta I have now running since it is functioning.

There tends to be a lot of flutter in the motions and it seems to have low accuracy - I'm wondering if this is simply the stage we are at with the kinect or if the non beta driver is more accurate. There are 2 drivers on my bonus page, 1 is beta , the other is 1.1, then there are instructions on another page to download the file from the microsoft site itself.

I have 1 beta plug in installed, which is working, the 1.1 installed which isn't working , then i have a microsoft section in my directory which is working ....and the documentation that i found is vague.

as I said, my setup is working now, and I'd hate to uninstall what is working in exchange for bugs and potential issues. If this is simply something that by nature is not very accurate, i can live with that, if the new non beta drivers are better, then I'd want that.

Please advise.

Thanks.

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

planetstardragon (2/15/2012)

Hi PSD

Previously there was only one Kinect Sensor available and this was designed for the XBox. In the last few weeks Microsoft have introduced a new version of the device called Kinect For Windows. This version is for PC's and not for the XBox.

Which version did you buy? if you bought the new Kinect For Windows it will be be clearly stated on the box. You can find out all about the new Kinect For Windows HERE.

By planetstardragon - 13 Years Ago

ahh, okie, that makes sense now, I got the xbox kinect ...which it did come with a regular USB plug ( so I didn't need the hard drive transfer adapter, which made me think it was a newer kinect ) - I saw the one you are speaking of which is the one Microsoft coined a business edition but thought that wasn't released yet.

So I am doing fine with the beta plug in, and the 1.1 version sdk is for the business eidition kinect.

Thank You.

Cheers,

Ricky

By Peter (RL) - 13 Years Ago

planetstardragon (2/15/2012)

So I am doing fine with the beta plug in, and the 1.1 version sdk is for the business eidition kinect.

Yes that's it. :)

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

An easy way to tell the differences in the Kinect models is the xBox one says "xBox" on the right side of the faceplate, and the Windows version says "Kinect"

By nigel - 13 Years Ago

Peter (RL) (2/15/2012)

nigel (2/14/2012)

I'm having the same problem, the new Kinect plug-in for Windows, fresh from my account, does not work but the beta version did.

Have the Kinect Xbox Sensor, Ok no probs I'll just re-install the Beta SDK. ;)

By planetstardragon - 13 Years Ago

I think the best way to avoid any confusion in the future with these drivers is to refer to the kinects as business edition vs xbox edition. even when you say windows kinect, since we can plug any kinect to a computer with usb - to a consumer, it's a windows version. Developers are cutting edge on their info, the business version kinect isn't common knowledge yet.

By Birddie - 13 Years Ago

Same problem. I can't for the life of me get it to work with my Dell laptop Windows 7. Shame, I really wanted to use it with Windows Kinect. I've installed and reinstalled the drives so many times I have A HEADACHE. I've never had problems installing software and drivers until Iclone came along.

And before you tell me to do this or that I already have. I followed all the suggestions in this thread and still a fail error. :(

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Finally, It all works: using the "Business" Kinect in Reallusion!

From my Members Page, I downloaded and installed:

The iClone v5.12 patch.

The Mocap Device Plug-in from the "Download" column of the Mocap Device Plug-in category.

The Microsoft Kinect SDK for Windows from the "Bonus" column of the Mocap Device Plug-in category.

Plugged in the Kinect into my Windows 7 computer (win 7 offers more mocap functions then earlier win versions) and the drivers installed correctly.

Started Mocap Device Plug-in. It fired right up and locked on to me quickly. It counted down from 4 and the four indicator icons on the left turned green : )

Started iClone, put an actor on the stage, clicked Animation, clicked Device Mocap in the right column and the Device Console appeared. Clicked Connect in the Device Console and a red Record box appeared on the left side of the Mocap Device Plug-in screen and the blue Preview box appeared on the right. (I have the "Body Command" box checked on the Mocap Device Plug-in screen)

I stood in front of the Kinect until my "bones" lined up. Reached over to the virtual on-screen Start button and in a couple of seconds, the Actor in iClone started to mimic my moves, It's very cool.

When you're recording or previewing, two crossed circles float above your shoulders, that's the "Stop" command; put each hand in a crossed circle and the recording / preview stops.

Having used Pro MoCap on major motion pictures this is pretty limited, however, it's really fun and I don't have 200 grand in it either! Plus, the real-time preview of your actual actor/character/creature is pretty amazing for the money.

In the future, I hope Reallusion adds the ability to use a second Kinect (like iPi). This would greatly increase accuracy and reduce much of the problems from using a single camera.

Thanks, Reallusion for all your hard work!

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

One thing I forgot to mention is that I uninstalled all of my earlier Kinect / Mocap programs and drivers from the computer.

I used Revo Uninstaller Pro to make sure that no crap was left behind. Be sure to check through all of your installed programs as the Microsoft driver installs several programs.

By animagic - 13 Years Ago

What I would like to know is if there are differences in Mocap quality between the Xbox Kinect and the Business Kinect when used with iClone. I bought the Xbox Kinect but haven't installed it yet. Is the Business Kinect the way forward?

By planetstardragon - 13 Years Ago

from what i've read so far, the business includes audio.

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

I know the current drivers for the "Business" Kinect adds Neck and Wrist angle motion capture. I don't know if the current drivers for the "xBox" version supports that.

From the Microsoft Kinect website:

The Kinect for Windows SDK offers an installer, which makes it easy to install the Kinect for Windows runtime and driver components for end-user deployment.

The Kinect for Windows sensor expands the possibilities for innovation with features like Near Mode, which enables the depth camera to see objects as close as 40 centimeters in front of the sensor. In addition, up to 4 Kinect sensors can now be plugged into the same computer.

One of the many improvements to the Kinect for Windows SDK is improved skeletal tracking, which lets developers control which user is being tracked by the sensor. In addition, the latest Microsoft Speech components, along with an improved acoustic model significantly improve speech recognition accuracy.

By planetstardragon - 13 Years Ago

ya, i think some of those features are driver driven because the xbox kinect moves wrists and neck - just not with great accuracy, 1 kinect, and the sensor flips out when you turn around or put your hand over your body, 4 kinects and you've got extreme detail. I am hoping they upgrade the xbox beta to the business driver level.

By chris_n - 13 Years Ago

Unfortunately, iClone only supports one Kinect for Windows at this time, but I hope Reallusion adds support for additional Kinects in a later release.

I don't know if the xBox version will get a newer Microsoft Windows SDK because of commercial licensing restrictions. Microsoft wants to push all Kinect PC development away from the xBox version to the Kinect for Windows 7/8 SDK.

By hgagne - 13 Years Ago

Just spent the better part of the evening refamiliarizing myself with all of the new information that was released to the public in the past month. As per the table matrix posted on RL, there are three flavors of drivers, two of which currently work with Kinect XB360:

Kinect XB360: OpenNI, SDK Beta2 (pre-110)
Kinect WIN7/8: SDK 1.10+

For Kinect XB360; aside from the commercial use issue, the driver options present a few challenges:

OpenNI is still a work-in-progress (aka BETA) and will likely change direction in future iterations
MS traditionally sets their SDK Beta with time restrictions - i.e. expiration
RL will likely not continue supporting Kinect XB360 in future versions - i.e. IC5.12+

IMHO, RL should revamp all of their Microsoft Kinect (XB360 & WIN7/8) related information on their website so as to make it more informative and less of a "search and rescue". At the moment, the information is spread out across the following areas of the site:

http://www.reallusion.com/iclone/iclone_mocap_device.aspx
http://faq.reallusion.com/?action=category&cat_id=011001006002
http://www.reallusion.com/iclone/iclone_whatsnew_v51.aspx
http://www.reallusion.com/iclone/help/iclone5/PRO/default.asp?page=08_Animation/Device_Mocap/Using_the_Device_Mocap_Panel.htm

https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic107446-281-1.aspx
https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic113330-281-1.aspx
https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic113330-281-1.aspx
https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic113330-281-1.aspx
https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic112463-281-1.aspx

IMHO,

As the MOCAP webpage (http://www.reallusion.com/iclone/iclone_mocap_device.aspx) is likely intended to serve as the main entry point, how about updating SETUP, FAQ, and MANUAL sections with the latest information.

Would also be help to create a new sub-forum specfic to the MOCAP software and move all MOCAP related threads to it.

Cheers,

By XT Multimedia - 13 Years Ago

Hi Cris
I have exactly the same problem, I have the Kinect for windows, the use mocap plugin 1.1 and windows 7, I tried to install in every way possible with no luck, I wanted to ask if your work did you get your Kinect and how you did it.

By Keith_MPS - 13 Years Ago

jjtroya,

I have the same setup and had problems getting it installed properly. The one thing I figured out was - don't use anything from the Microsoft website or the CD that comes with the Kinect for Windows. If you have them installed, uninstall them.

Use only stuff downloaded from Reallusion and it will work with iClone properly. After I got that working, I checked the applications that come with the Kinect CD and they worked properly, too.