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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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I'm surprised at the lack of female motion packs. For every male action, there should be a parallel female action, unless it's specifically gender-related (like a woman lifting her breast to look at her abs, or a man fixing his pants so they don't ride up so high). I need female solder movements and all that is available are men's actions. Not sure if the recorders of MoCap data around the world realize that men's and women's body movements are very different. Having the same motion may work for a cartoon, but not for realism. The female body is unique in its design as well as its motion. Sadly, I need to bring this up. You think it would be common sense. Especially in a capitalist society.
List of requested motions:
Female Soldier Pack
Female Stealth Pack
Female Combat Pack
Female Driving Pack
Female Sports Pack
Female Fitness Pack
Female Climbing Pack
Men and Women Gymnastics Pack
Men and Women Olympic Pack
I'm sure the rest can be figured out.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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The female body is unique in its design as well as its motion. That maybe true (sometimes) for generic actions like walking or gesturing during speech but how exactly does on “Feminize” actions like Driving vehicles or firing military weapons?
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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If you can't understand what I'm saying, run this test.
If you're a man, try to act like a woman when you record your animations. Then have a woman record the same motion and see which is accurate.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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zancoisrice (3/23/2024)
If you can't understand what I'm saying, run this test.
If you're a man, try to act like a woman when you record your animations. Then have a woman record the same motion and see which is accurate.
Well there are alot of AI driven mocap solutions that do not require expensive suits etc. Perhaps you should consider creating your own “feminized” motions yourself.
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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Perhaps there is a misunderstanding, I'm not interested in creating keyframes by hand. I work with Mocap daily and when I run into Mocap issues I'd like the option to have an alternate motion capture action available from Actorcore so that I can quickly replace any errors I encounter from the Mocap instability. When working with women actors, I need live-action women-specific motions, not cartoon animations.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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You should Put in a request on the feedback tracker for more female specific motions but most canned “combat” Motions are likely going to be gender neutral to appeal to the widest range of potential buyers. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding, I'm not interested in creating keyframes by hand…I'm not interested in creating keyframes by hand… I need live-action women-specific motionsI need live-action women-specific motions Right, AI mocap from video is not keyframed by hand if you need something really specific you might need to create it yourself.
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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I did, it's just troubling that I need to mention this. This isn't a post just about Reallusion or Actorcore alone, It's about the broader market. This absence is consistent. I recommend that Reallusion take the initiative and provide these assets to truly be leaders in the market.
Take a look at all previous video games and recreate those actions for the public. I would do it myself, but I'm not a major corporation nor do I have the resources, time, or people power to make something that large happen.
Take the Microsoft approach, not Apple, and provide PCs (Motion Capture) to the public not just for corporations.
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By Nirwana - Last Year
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If you can't understand what I'm saying, run this test.
If you're a man, try to act like a woman when you record your animations. Then have a woman record the same motion and see which is accurate.
If you can record you own mocap, why do you need canned mocap? Also, if you actually need female combat motions, you may have to create them yourself, since, as you mentioned elsewhere, there appears to be not really a market for that. Why do you expect profit-oriented companies to produce products that will apparently not sell? If they did, somebody would probably be offering them.
BTW: Are you sure that viewers/players will actually notice any gender-specific subtle motions in an action scene?
Personally, I have no need for female combat motions because I would not want to put a female character in a combat role in animation. It's bad enough that men have to do fighting. (I'm talking about realistic scenarios and not games). Therefore, I'd not be interested in purchasing such motions in the first place.
What I'm saying is that if you want niche content, you may have to create it yourself. And if you are successful in doing so, you can sell such motions and see how well they do commercially.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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BTW: Are you sure that viewers/players will actually notice any gender-specific subtle motions in an action scene?.
Nope In fact ,in these times the popular trend is overpowered “girl bosses” punching ,shooting and controlling vehicles& aircraft just like men as movie studios seem very keen to avoid being accused of “traditional gender role stereotyping”
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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Wow....
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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Regarding Zancoisrice's point, there is a very significant difference between even the hardest/tomboyish based female movements versus a male's masculine movements. In your video example, you will see that all the women still have a highly noticeable difference in their movements than that of their male counterparts.
There will always be a specific graceful movement in a woman's body motions than that of a man. Men were made to be masculine, as women were made to be feminine. So, it doesn't matter what the situation is, (just to make a solid point ONLY) whether it's a man trying to portray a woman, or vice versa, neither will ever actually do it accordingly because they were not made to be that particular sex. It is what it is. If you are a man, you will be that forever in every which way possible. If you are a woman, then you will be that forever in every which way possible, no ifs ands or buts. It will display in your movements globally.
That being said, I do agree with the request to make more female based movements. If there is going to be a motion pack delivered moving forward (ie: Rifle Combat Combo Motions Pack), there should be a woman's version added along in that same pack.
DISCLAIMER: This was not to offend anyone that is identifying to be whatever. It was strictly to just make the point in regards to differentiating gender based movements. I apologize ahead of time if my words came across the wrong way.
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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@Nirwana,
One simple phrase to solve this puzzle...Production time saver.
There you have it! It's much faster (and easier IMO) to just drop a motion in there and slightly adjust it to fit your needs, then keep it moving than to go through the whole process yourself. You're paying all this money for the software and content anyway, so why not ask for that? Do we have to pay someone else for the software, and yet still do everything on our own? That be the case, forget Reallusion software...just strap on a suit, and get the FREE UE5/Blender program(s) then do it yourself, or better yet, why don't we just create our own animation program then? 😁
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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I agree completely that there are clear BIOLOGICAL differences between men and women and they are evident in everything they do. It is a terrible shame that this is now a controversial thing to say in the current “culture” and would get me
Dog piled or even banned from many online spaces just for saying it.. On the matter of female version of commercial combat motions I still maintain that the merchants here will likely to continue to make them gender neutral at best But this is the larger problem with becoming dependent on canned mocap libraries in the first place. Right now I can nearly always spot an iclone motion clip or a Mixamo one from KILOMETER away.
The OP is asking for specificity from a canned mass production mocap market that works on volume. (Actorcore)
yet still do everything on our own? That be the case, forget Reallusion software...just strap on a suit, and get the FREE UE5/Blender program(s) then do it yourself,
Well if you study the science of “gait analysis” (the way people walk) you will find that there are clear differences between the way young urban black males walk compared to whites, asians, and hispanics and you get even more variety when you move to the middle aged demographics. There are ZERO walking motions in the Actorcore libraries that you could claim are of a young urban Black male walking.
So yes your only option, in this case, is recording you own or spend the time editing generic mass market imotion clips to get the style you need I am not here crying “racism” or any such nonsense. just stating a fact that when you stay within any 3D Character animation ecosystem you will be limited to what that eco system offers in canned generic content. This is true for Daz studio users ..and even Blender, Maya or C4D user to a certain extent.
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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"Well if you study the science of “gate analysis” (the way people walk) you will find that there are clear differences between the way young urban black males walk compared to whites, asians, and hispanics and you get even more variety when you move to the middle aged demographics. There are ZERO walking motions in the Actorcore libraries that you could claim are of a young urban Black male walking."
(just making a point ONLY) I couldn't agree with you more, on every point that you have expressed. For this reason, I wish I did have a suit of my own to authenticate certain movements to represent as such, (admittingly being of Black culture). Outside of motion packs, I've already mentioned even about the creation of certain urban hairstyles that still has yet to be seen in either the marketplace, or content store, and I've been around since the beginning of the new gen style (iC6/CC1). Seems as if our particular race is the last to be considered when it comes to any form of artistic content. There has to be a massive request, or concern, brought out in order for it to really be considered/implemented. I'm still waiting on a specified style of urban braided hair and cuts that has yet to be made. LOL 🤣
"It is a terrible shame that this is now a controversial thing to say in the current “culture” and would get me
Dog piled or even banned from many online spaces just for saying it.."
That's the sad twist of the world today as we live in it unfortunately, but it's how this era is now ran, so these are the rules we have to follow. Whatever we can do to keep from certain "controversial" conflict(s) coming our way, we do, right? LOL 😁
DISCLAIMER: This was NOT a racial profiling conversation. Please do not take it as such. Thank you!
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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AutoDidact (3/25/2024)
There are ZERO walking motions in the Actorcore libraries that you could claim are of a young urban Black male walking
This is another issue in itself... Just gonna be happy with what we have for now. If the makers of the Mocap don't feel it's relevant to their libraries that's their prerogative. They own the software. This is a wide-open door for a competitor....
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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LogicalWarrior (3/25/2024)
@Nirwana,
One simple phrase to solve this puzzle...Production time saver.
There you have it! It's much faster (and easier IMO) to just drop a motion in there and slightly adjust it to fit your needs, then keep it moving than to go through the whole process yourself. You're paying all this money for the software and content anyway, so why not ask for that? Do we have to pay someone else for the software, and yet still do everything on our own? That be the case, forget Reallusion software...just strap on a suit, and get the FREE UE5/Blender program(s) then do it yourself, or better yet, why don't we just create our own animation program then? 😁
Thank you!! Someone finally gets it. Can't believe it took all this to explain the natural difference between the 2 sexes.
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By animagic - Last Year
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Strapping on a suit won't help me unless I want an old man's gait...:unsure:
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By Nirwana - Last Year
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One simple phrase to solve this puzzle...Production time saver.
There you have it! It's much faster (and easier IMO) to just drop a motion in there and slightly adjust it to fit your needs, then keep it moving than to go through the whole process yourself. You're paying all this money for the software and content anyway, so why not ask for that?
Well, yeah, of course it would save production time/make things easier.
And, sure, you can "ask". But, and that is my point, if you want something that the market is not offering (presumably for economic reasons) is it reasonable to expect companies (be it Reallusion or somebody else) to spend money on it if there is apparently little expectation (I'm guessing) of making it back just because you purchased their software? If the market does not offer what you want and you have the capabilities to create it yourself, then why not do it? And if there actually is an untapped demand for something like gender-specific (combat/action) motions, you can make a bundle.
There are, after all, other gender-specific motions already available on the RL platforms.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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If the market does not offer what you want and you have the capabilities to create it yourself, then why not do it?. I learned how to model and rig my own Characters and props for this very reason I know people will say “I don’t have time to learn to do this or that “ fair enough, but again limited choices are the reality of relying upon an ecosystem of prefabbed content. you either “make do” what they are mass producing for a general user base make it (animate it) yourself or pay for someone to make you something $$$bespoke$$$. for your specific needs.
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By ender570 - Last Year
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I would settle for the mocap series just not being so terribly overacted. Every single one feels like it's ripped from an early 3D JRPG...
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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animagic (3/26/2024)
Strapping on a suit won't help me unless I want an old man's gait...:unsure:
😂😂
Hey, animations come in ALL different styles/brands! As a matter of fact, they have all of these senior crowd packs now, so a few animations to coincide with those avatars would be IDEA! After all, making the point of this thread, everyone doesn't have the same motion of movement to just neutralize the animation packs, even though that's the industry's direction of marketing/selling point.
https://actorcore.reallusion.com/3d-character?orderBy=Relevance&keyword=senior
I'd say go for it! I'll surely invest in it and put it to use really quick! 👍😁
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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ender570 (3/26/2024)
I would settle for the mocap series just not being so terribly overacted. Every single one feels like it's ripped from an early 3D JRPG...
You're never lying about that one! I'm like, really people, do you ever see anyone actually move like this? The acting (not trying to step on toes, but...) is really not that great, and you are pretty much revamping the entire motion yourself via keyframing anyway, so it's kind of like you actually ARE doing it yourself! LOL 😂🤣
Although, it still saves time from doing the actual process yourself, to just optimize it and call it a day. So, that's just what I go with and keep it moving. 😁
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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AutoDidact (3/26/2024)
If the market does not offer what you want and you have the capabilities to create it yourself, then why not do it?. I learned how to model and rig my own Characters and props for this very reason I know people will say “I don’t have time to learn to do this or that “ fair enough, but again limited choices are the reality of relying upon an ecosystem of prefabbed content. you either “make do” what they are mass producing for a general user base make it (animate it) yourself or pay for someone to make you something $$$bespoke$$$. for your specific needs.
I'll take "pay for someone to make me something $$$bespoke$$$ for my specific needs" any day, please! It's so much easier than waiting for RL to ACT like they are listening to you, and then deliver something (1 year later) that is only partial of what you requested. LOL 😂
Although, as of late, I"ve just been using other sites as well (mocaponline, mixamo, etc.) to also help in this area so I can have a variety, in case I can't find it in iC8 CS/MP.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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\You're never lying about that one! I'm like, really people, do you ever see anyone actually move like this? The acting (not trying to step on toes, but...) is really not that great, There is a place for that exaggerated acting in “Pixar” style animated films the problem is that many people do not know when it is appropriate to use it
or they are just kit bashing canned motion clips. I hand keyed everything in this Blender animation except the audio based lipsinc from Daz studio.
However this acting style is NOT appropriate for an animated action scene like one made in iclone with edited Imotion clips
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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AutoDidact (3/26/2024)
\You're never lying about that one! I'm like, really people, do you ever see anyone actually move like this? The acting (not trying to step on toes, but...) is really not that great, There is a place for that exaggerated acting in “Pixar” style animated films the problem is that many people do not know when it is appropriate to use it
or they are just kit bashing canned motion clips. I hand keyed everything in this Blender animation except the audio based lipsinc from Daz studio.
However this acting style is NOT appropriate for an animated action scene like one made in iclone with edited Imotion clips
You're absolutely right! Although, even some of the packs that are geared towards the realistic movements have over exaggerated movements. Now the motions for toons is a different story, but as for the most part, I've tried using a combination of some of the more recent packs for conversation scenes, and find myself still doing a great deal of editing due to how much movement they put into these motions. People don't constantly move their head and body with their arms the way some of these motion packs are portrayed. Some of these motions would make one think that the mocap actors/actresses had ADHD! Unless it's something you're extremely excited and animated about, you're not going to constantly be moving your entire body to the conversation. I'm just saying....
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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Some of these motions would make one think that the mocap actors/actresses had ADHD! Unless it's something you're extremely excited and animated about, you're not going to constantly be moving your entire body to the conversation. I'm just saying....
The biggest problem I see in the canned motion clip “film making” community is that most people do not study actual cinematic film making and visual storytelling. They do not understand the some of the best movie scenes are two characters having a conversation with tight head/shoulder camera shots.
Many do not have good story narrative so they depend on wide full body camera framing with all sort of ridiculous hand/arm gestures and that make sure their outfits they bought from the market get fully shown. the pacing is always rushed.
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By Peter (RL) - Last Year
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zancoisrice (3/23/2024)
I'm surprised at the lack of female motion packs. For every male action, there should be a parallel female action, unless it's specifically gender-related (like a woman lifting her breast to look at her abs, or a man fixing his pants so they don't ride up so high). I need female solder movements and all that is available are men's actions. Not sure if the recorders of MoCap data around the world realize that men's and women's body movements are very different. Having the same motion may work for a cartoon, but not for realism. The female body is unique in its design as well as its motion. Sadly, I need to bring this up. You think it would be common sense. Especially in a capitalist society.
List of requested motions:
Female Soldier Pack
Female Stealth Pack
Female Combat Pack
Female Driving Pack
Female Sports Pack
Female Fitness Pack
Female Climbing Pack
Men and Women Gymnastics Pack
Men and Women Olympic Pack
I'm sure the rest can be figured out.
Thank you for the feedback. Your suggestions will be reviewed and considered by the ActorCore team for future packs.
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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AutoDidact (3/26/2024)
Some of these motions would make one think that the mocap actors/actresses had ADHD! Unless it's something you're extremely excited and animated about, you're not going to constantly be moving your entire body to the conversation. I'm just saying....
The biggest problem I see in the canned motion clip “film making” community is that most people do not study actual cinematic film making and visual storytelling. They do not understand the some of the best movie scenes are two characters having a conversation with tight head/shoulder camera shots.
Many do not have good story narrative so they depend on wide full body camera framing with all sort of ridiculous hand/arm gestures and that make sure their outfits they bought from the market get fully shown. the pacing is always rushed.
PRECISELY! You would think that at some point the industry would pick up on this and change it. Sometimes, the simplest things in life make the greatest impact/statement in regards to it (life). Maybe one day, globally, they'll get it. 👍😁
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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Nirwana (3/26/2024)
[quote] If the market does not offer what you want and you have the capabilities to create it yourself, then why not do it? And if there actually is an untapped demand for something like gender-specific (combat/action) motions, you can make a bundle.
Not sure if you've ever done Motion Capture cleanup, but it's a nightmare. The systems aren't there yet to capture perfection or relative perfection. You would need a high-end system for that and the cheapest high-end system, I think cost around $20K, plus you have to pay a yearly software fee of like $5k (Don't quote me I haven't checked out those systems in years).
It gets really expensive. I direct this at Reallusion because they have the tools and people power to produce these motions. I contacted the people who make mocap for Unreal and to be honest I don't think they even know about Reallusion or Omniverse. Let's see what they decide to do.
The bottom line is when I have motion capture footage that is too tedious to clean up I'd like to have the option to just pay for a replacement. Specifically from Reallusion. Going from iClone to Omniverse is seamless.
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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I'll give you guys a preview of what I'm working on.
Test Animation
This Motion was captured with Move.AI. It's a good system, however, it suffers with arm motions.
This is my series website. Still in development.
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By Nirwana - Last Year
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Not sure if you've ever done Motion Capture cleanup, but it's a nightmare.
Not of raw mocap data, but I have had to clean up purchased mocap files for iClone. Just because it is for sale, does not mean it's "perfect" either. Also, some of the for-sale stuff already looks pretty bad in the promo video of the respective creator so that I don't even consider a purchase.
I was under the (apparently mistaken) impression that you had proper mocap equipment and people (male and female) familiar with acting for mocap at you disposal when I suggested that you create your own mocap. If AI-assisted mocap based on video footage is all you have, then I withdraw that suggestion.
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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No, unfortunately, everyone I work with is out-of-pocket work for hire right now. I'm a one-man production studio. I'm doing it all at the moment. I'd love to hire staff eventually. But for now I gotta bite the bullet. This is why having these motions available is important.
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By Nirwana - Last Year
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Well, I'm a one-man hobbyist. ;-)
So far, I'm not capable of producing content (animations, not 3D assets) that I'd feel comfortable charging money for. In fact, that is one of the reasons I'm not even trying to get my YouTube channel monetized.
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By AutoDidact - Last Year
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It gets really expensive. I direct this at Reallusion because they have the tools and people power to produce these motions. I contacted the people who make mocap for Unreal and to be honest I don't think they even know about Reallusion or Omniverse. Let's see what they decide to do. The bottom line is when I have motion capture footage that is too tedious to clean up I'd like to have the option to just pay for a replacement. Specifically from Reallusion. Going from iClone to Omniverse is seamless.
Even with todays capture systems there are always going to be a need for mocap clean up particularly with weapons handling. the only software that will get you close to capturing perfectly clean human motion ( with expensive capture suits )is the mighty Autodesk Motion builder which prohibitively expensive of course. I have the entire Mixamo libraries collected in an offline archive in both FBX and Imotion format. (over 2,400 animations) they have quite alot of paramilitary combat style motions with people carrying rifles similar to what is in your video and many of them are marked “Female”
I used them extensively in my last 50 minute Iclone movie last summer
And also in this project, from three years ago, animated in Iclone but rendered in blender.
You can kitbash alot of military style weapon handling action with the FREE mixamo libraries with minimal need for major clean up except for adjusting hands & fingers to whatever weapon props you have.
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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Nirwana (3/27/2024)
Well, I'm a one-man hobbyist. ;-)
So far, I'm not capable of producing content (animations, not 3D assets) that I'd feel comfortable charging money for. In fact, that is one of the reasons I'm not even trying to get my YouTube channel monetized.
This is EXACTLY who I am, and where I stand currently. That's why I don't have anything up on my channel as well. I've been doing side projects (short film, amateur leveled stuff) for some of the amateur film groups that I connected with in Facebook for a little while now, but of course, that's strictly scripting (NDA based), and using this as only a storyboarding platform.
I've wanted to do some stuff on my own to promote me, but I just never really have the time to do my own stuff. Such is REAL life...sigh! 😒
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By LogicalWarrior - Last Year
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AutoDidact (3/27/2024)
It gets really expensive. I direct this at Reallusion because they have the tools and people power to produce these motions. I contacted the people who make mocap for Unreal and to be honest I don't think they even know about Reallusion or Omniverse. Let's see what they decide to do. The bottom line is when I have motion capture footage that is too tedious to clean up I'd like to have the option to just pay for a replacement. Specifically from Reallusion. Going from iClone to Omniverse is seamless.
Even with todays capture systems there are always going to be a need for mocap clean up particularly with weapons handling. the only software that will get you close to capturing perfectly clean human motion ( with expensive capture suits )is the mighty Autodesk Motion builder which prohibitively expensive of course. I have the entire Mixamo libraries collected in an offline archive in both FBX and Imotion format. (over 2,400 animations) they have quite alot of paramilitary combat style motions with people carrying rifles similar to what is in your video and many of them are marked “Female”
TBH... A great deal of my animations are from using Mixamo and Mocaponline animations, as I find them to have more of what I'm looking for, and yes, even female based animations separately. In addition, being FREE (Mixamo) makes it so much better too, where you are getting quality motions, with very little editing, to work with, making for a higher production value and better time usage much more prevalent.
I'll use Reallusion's animations for like maybe a simple motion base, for walking or something, or maybe throw in a motion to connect to something else similar from the other two, that would give it a more diverse look, then blend them together so it can have a very unique look/style, also depending on what I'm doing, be it realism or toon/stylized. Crazy thing is....I own pretty much EVERY motion pack that comes out from Reallusion just to have in Library.
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By zancoisrice - Last Year
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I produced some IP content back in the day and it didn't get any attention and I hand-animated the entire project. I even got a cease and desist from Upper Deck over my model of Michael Jordan. So from that point on it's all about my IP. Screw fan art. No offense just my personal opinion.
My work can be found here:
Solid Commando
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