Advanced puppet tool


https://forum.reallusion.com/Topic293530.aspx
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By animagic - 3 Years Ago
mark_20091217133447147 (8/17/2016)
I'm surprised no one has commented on this vastly improved puppet tool for a whole week.

This was discussed in another thread, so there was no reason to comment here, even when the message text is in a huge font. Also, as Peter has pointed out and has been known for some time, RL is working on improvements. This obviously doesn't detract from the great work by 3DTest.
By Rampa - 3 Years Ago
Now I have them installed. What an amazing improvement!
By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
Rampa, thanks for the tips. I did read the instructions twice before I installed the AFP so I have that covered. And now after looking at it again I can make the avatar stick out her tongue. Yesterday I couldn't because I was trying to do so in 3DXchange too and  that is where I was and still cannot seem to get it to work. In IC6 it works but initially although I could get the avatar to stick her tongue out, I was wanting her just to stick it straight out, like when you stick your tongue out at someone. BigGrin But I must have missed the correct controller because the tongue was going out to the left and right etc but not straight. I figured it out today. Good stuff this AFP. But for my other issue that you explained about changing the original default avatar, I just added mine to the custom section. What I wanted to do was add a folder like the other folders in there named 3DTest, but although I added it where all those other folders are on my pc, it does not show up in the content manager. Is there a way to add a folder to the content manager?
Thanks again,
TS

By hj - 3 Years Ago
The Second Avatar is Created with your Avatar in the Base folder

By hj - 3 Years Ago
Hi Mike
if I take your avatar as base in CC, I lose morphs tongue when I create new avatars in CC

https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/f494c49e-c15a-460d-a5a4-8a5f.jpg



https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/6361f026-74e7-4b18-bad7-4663.jpg

This avatar is createt with CC_Standard_AFPx.iAvatar in the Base of CC and it he losted 6 tounge-morphs

best
hj
By mtakerkart - 3 Years Ago
WOW!! If this topic has initiated this initiative ,i'm very proud of it ;-) Ok just kidding....
Very good news anyway!
By Galfridus - 3 Years Ago
Excellent. Thank you very much Mike.
Geoff.
By Rampa - 3 Years Ago
I actually recommend setting up a CC character exactly as you like it to replace the default one.

I made a new default from the one 3D Test provided. I added a female morph (with a belly button!), set the skin to no makeup, tan, or freckles in the appearance editor. Set both head and body texture size to 2048 in the appearance editor. I used the "base female" skin as my starting point.

For those places where the nudity may be an issue, you can load some underwear on your default model. Then you'll always get a clothed model when you open CC or hit "New".
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago

hi hj,

sorry, but from your screenshots it looks to me like second one is the standard default avatar - where indeed there are no tongue morphs, none of the additional morphs (and no doubt none of the improved default morphs either).

If you are using an  AFP avatar (either the new default or the AFPx avatar), then the new morphs, including tongue are retained in CC, 3DX and iC6.

Short of the user manually removing the morphs in 3DX, the only circumstances in which they won't be retained are:

* if you swap the AFPavatar for another which was built with the stock default (which doesn't have the improved and additional morphs) 

From the readme documentation:
_________________

5) Compatibility:

The new default avatar remains a standard CC avatar and is fully compatible for modelling in Character Creator, editing in 3DXchange, as well as animation in iClone.

The new avatar is also backwards compatible in everything except complete replacement eg: if the new avatar is swapped out for the stock default (or a model created from the stock default), then facial animation quality will be reduced due to absence of the additional morphs.

In order to use earlier models effectively with this system, the user can morph-in the earlier character's base mesh in 3DXchange or via Character Creator, and apply textures manually.

NB: The user can also apply a pre-existing character's head and head textures to the new default avatar directly in iClone

_________________________

Basically, if you don't have the additional morphs (tongue included), then you're not actually using an AFP avatar: at some point you've swapped it with the stock default, or a model built from the stock default - without following the rules described in the readme. I guess one point of difficulty for folks might be thinking that loading their own previously built iAvatar somehow 'meshes' with whichever default you have in CC, which I'm afraid it doesn't: if you load a new project, it replaces the avatar - hence to use previous models with an AFP avatar you need to morph them in, and apply textures manually (and/ or as described in the readme, apply heads to AFP avatars in iC6). There's no way around this I'm afraid - but it is worth doing if you want to get the best of the AFP system.

Hope this helps!

Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)

By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago
Hi Folks,

....please do not follow the instructions for loading the avatar in the above video - I'm afraid they're incorrect. If you do follow them (by putting the AFP avatar in the CC template>Base folder), then the only part of the AFP avatar you'll get is the textures - the rest of the avatar will be the standard default, so it won't have the animation morph improvements or the additional animation morphs, or the custom morphs needed to allow the AFP to work fully.

Sorry - I thought I'd been clear in the readme - but folks seem to be having some trouble with this, so I'll try to clarify:

* you can replace your default avatar by loading one of the AFP avatars and saving the project as your default project (CC_Standard.ccProject in iClone Character Creator 1 > Program > Assets > Creator), but NB please don't copy the avatar itself to the template>Base folder
* you can also simply load the AFP iAvatar file into CC and start modelling and texturing - then save or send to iClone
* you can use morphs, textures, anything you like in CC - NB except anything (such as models in CC's Project Template folder) which asks if you want to 'Load Project' - because if you say 'yes' to this - unless you're loading a project which already uses an AFP avatar - it will automatically load a stock default avatar

Again, I'm sorry folks seem to be having difficulty with this - but I hope that these points, as well as the important information in the readme - allow you to get the most out of the system.

Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)

PS (& NB): the easiest way to tell if you're using an AFP avatar or not is in Face Puppet (assuming you're using the AFP profiles) - can you animate the tongue? If you can - then it's an AFP avatar, if you can't - then it's a standard avatar which is simply not as functional. Check out the tongue controls in Mouth Open, second two controls at the end of the row. If these don't work, yet you're sure you started with an AFP avatar - then at some point it's been swapped out for the default.










By AasmundSchei - 3 Years Ago
Yes, this would be a dreamtool for character designers. Hope the Reallusion product team have seen this.
By Peter (RL) - 3 Years Ago
Greatly improved facial animation is something the team are working on for the next version of iClone. We will announce more soon. Smile
By DebMark Productions - 3 Years Ago
Thanks Mike! You are very helpful!  This is something iClone has needed from the very start.  You have filled the need and have done it well. And its free! As I believe you stated in a previous post, the next thing needed is to make the face and skin textures more realistic. Back in the 2001 I watched the movie, Final Fantasy: the Spirits Within.  It took me 15 minutes into the movie to realize the characters were not real people, but rather, avatars.  That's the realism I am looking for in iClone one of these days if it is possible. I heard that it takes a better rendering engine that goes over the action many times to get better light scattering and skin depth.
By wires - 3 Years Ago
Totally amazing. w00t Thank you very much for your generosity. SmileCoolSmooooth
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago

hi hj,

so...you've copied the AFP avatar into the Base folder. Question - have you then loaded another figure from the base folder onto it, where CC asks you if you want to load project or replace costume only? If not, please explain your workflow fully and clearly - I am trying to help you here.

Mike (3Dtest)

PS from your screenshots - the second one is not an AFP avatar. even though you say 'no' - the AFP avatar has clearly been swapped out for a stock default avatar: that's why the avatar in your second screenshot is called CC_Standard and doesn't have the extra morphs.



By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago

Hi Folks, please do read the readme document which comes with the AFP - there's info in there about how to make more realistic animation using the system, as well as important tips on modelling for animation.

My worry is that those who don't read the documentation will simply use the profiles without an AFP avatar (which has essential additional morphs, and default morph improvements which the system is designed for), and without considering the factors involved in both facial animation itself as well as good modelling for facial animation - whereby the results will not be as effective as they could be.

The system is extremely powerful if you can use it as it's designed to be used.  But you do need to read the documentation, If not, you might get a few more facial wiggles out of it than with iClone's default profiles - but you won't be able to realize the full potential.

So please. please, please read the documentation - it's written for everyone who really wants to do better facial animation with iClone Smile

Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)

By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
Very cool, I hope we can get it one way or another. Smile
By Rampa - 3 Years Ago
Woohoo! Thanks for making this awesome new facial system. The new skin is great too. Smile
By Rampa - 3 Years Ago
For those having some issues.

Find the default CC project file called "CC_Standard.ccProject".
It is located in "C:\Program Files\Reallusion\iClone Character Creator 1\Program\Assets\Creator".

Duplicate it if you want a backup. Wink

Unzip the package from 3D Test.

Rename the the iAvatar you of your choosing to "CC_Standard.ccProject".

Replace the original one with your newly renamed one. Now it is the default avatar.

If you want your default avatar to again be female, like the original, apply the female morph(s) and save it. Then you put that one as the default.

Everything in the "Profile" folder of the ZIP should go in your Template/Profile" folder. You can either keep or toss the original profiles. I tossed all of them except "Solo Feature".
By stuwhit - 3 Years Ago
Hi
Is AFP available to all or just a select few?
If it is for all, where do you find it? 
Thanks
stu

By mtakerkart - 3 Years Ago
I don't know if this could help but I think this guy explain how to install it:


By sureshmadhusanka - 3 Years Ago
RL Please pay attention to this wonderful work and add this amazing puppet tool to iclone


By VirtualMedia - 3 Years Ago
Peter (RL) (8/17/2016)
Greatly improved facial animation is something the team are working on for the next version of iClone. We will announce more soon. Smile


Thanks for another confirmation Peter, I've nearly reached my limits with the current IC facial animation limitations. 

By RobertoColombo - 3 Years Ago
Wow!!! thanks a lot!!!
Really, really nice of you Smile
By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
Wow, I just installed this and it is great! I wasn't sure how to put the AFP.iAvatar in the Character Creator like the folders for Tokomotion etc, so I just put it in the Custom section. I have a question though. How do you get the tongue to stick out? When I try it with the face puppet, the mouth stays closed but it looks like the tongue wants to stick out. When I check it in 3D exchange, I can open the mouth and make the tongue move but it stops right at the lips. I am sure it must be something simple but I am having fun with all the advanced expressions so I must have missed something. Another cool thing is you can load you old project onto the new AFP.iAvatar so you do not have to start from scratch. Excellent job.
Thanks again,
TS
By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
I figured out that I can only create a new folder in the custom section but that works for me. I guess purchased content gets installed with extra permissions or registry settings. I am good to go. Wink
TS
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago

Ok hj, 

Whilst that's not exactly a clear of full description of your workflow (!) - I believe what you're doing is this:

* you're loading the AFP avatar into CC (from the Base folder or from file > open project)
* then you're loading another avatar from your Base folder onto it - eg from 'essential morphs' or another content pack - upon which CC asks you if want to 'load project or replace costume only'  
* you then click 'load project' - which means you've just replaced the AFP avatar with a stock default avatar

It's important to realize that the models in the base folder aren't simply morphs which mix with the avatar you have loaded in CC. They're complete avatars (projects), which if you load them, replace the existing avatar altogether - which is why you keep replacing the AFP avatar with a stock default.

So If you want to use an AFP avatar - do not replace it with a non-AFP avatar. 

If you want to use morphs from avatars in the Base folder - make sliders from them and apply them to the AFP avatar. If you want to use textures from avatars in the Base folder - export them from those avatars and apply them to an AFP avatar manually. You can also apply morphs and textures via 3DXchange.

Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)








By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
Hj,
 Don't feel bad, I was doing the same thing.Tongue
TS
By VirtualMedia - 3 Years Ago
3Dtest... (8/24/2016)

Hi Folks, just to let everyone know that following a positive discussion with Reallusion last week, I sent my latest AFP (advanced face puppet) system to them on Monday this week for testing/ evaluation.

Whether this new animation approach (or a derivation of it) will ultimately be incorporated into iClone, sold separately by RL, or whether I release this myself is yet to be decided - but I'll let everyone know the outcome as soon as I can via my YouTube channel, as well as this forum - meanwhile, thanks for bearing with me - as well as RL Smile

Regards - Mike (3Dtest)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKtjihhZQ_qmxEmbBzxt-nQ



Great to see all your work being appreciated and or integrated, into the next version of IC. Thanks for bringing the need and potential of a facial animation overhaul in IC to the attention of RL.

Keep us posted!

By theschemer - 3 Years Ago
Thanks Mike. Very nice. I can't wait to try it out. The demo looks great.
TS
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago
Hi Folks, I hope everyone who's downloaded the AFP has read the documentation, and is finding the system reasonably easy to learn and use. If you haven't read the documentation, you may find compatibility issues - such as if you swap in an old avatar in place of the AFP avatar - it won't work quite so well (it just doesn't have the extra morphs, and its default morphs aren't so good either...) , but you can get round that - see the compatibility section in the readme file. So if you're finding something isn't working - please check that you're actually using an AFP avatar - and if you definitely are, but say can't get the tongue to come out, or something else doesn't appear to be working - do you have the correct profile and controller selected which actually allows this? There a lot of controllers there - so please do try them all and familiarise yourself with the whole system...Smile

Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)

PS Please read the documentation....! Smile
By ToKoMotion - 3 Years Ago
Hi Mike.

This is amazing!!! Just installed it and made a quick test - works perfect! Thanks a lot for making it available. It's like a new update has been releasedBigGrin. I can't appreciate enough all the time you invested to create it. Outstanding work.

Best,
Tobias 
By hj - 3 Years Ago
Thank you for your Support. I fortgot, that cc saved the works in Project-Filets. In iclone the Projekts are more than only the avatar.
The way to get the Rl-projects is, to make a morph and create the new avatare with this morph-Information and your avatar as Base.
Sorry for confusion and sorry for my simple Englisch.
Your Tool is absolut Great, i like to use it.
Best hj
By mtakerkart - 3 Years Ago
@sureshmadhusanka

Reallusion know about this advance puppet because I started a thread last month :
https://forum.reallusion.com/FindPost292563.aspx

@Peter
This kind of answer really make my day!!! :-) Thank you

By animagic - 3 Years Ago
stuwhit (9/23/2016)
Hi
Is AFP available to all or just a select few?
If it is for all, where do you find it? 
Thanks
stu

It's explained in the description of the YouTube video about the AFP. See this post: https://forum.reallusion.com/FindPost296428.aspx.
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago


Thanks to RL for giving me permission to release this to the user base - hopefully folks might find it useful Smile
Regards,

Mike (3Dtest)

PS Please read the documentation!
By sjonesdc - 3 Years Ago
3DTest,

Thank you!!!!.
By VirtualMedia - 3 Years Ago
Excellent share Mike, thanks for going above and beyond.
By hj - 3 Years Ago
Sorry, i think, i got may wrong thinking . I thought cc will take the Base-Avatar in every project, i will loaded.

Hj
By hj - 3 Years Ago
sorry
By animagic - 3 Years Ago
mtakerkart (8/24/2016)
WOW!! If this topic has initiated this initiative ,i'm very proud of it ;-) Ok just kidding....
Very good news anyway!

We will give you some credit...Tongue
By DebMark Productions - 3 Years Ago
I'm surprised no one has commented on this vastly improved puppet tool for a whole week.  I agree. There is no reason Reallusion should not incorporate this or something similar into iClone.  I wonder if this type of improvement will be included in iClone 7.  If not, I would be interested in purchasing it from you if it isn't expensive.  I am always looking for ways to make my animations more realistic. I heard that iClone 7 will have a better, realistic renderer than it currently has for animation. Changing textures while animating is also a great idea.
By mark - 3 Years Ago
Truly fantastic work!!!! THANKS!!!!!BigGrin
By sjonesdc - 3 Years Ago
Thank you!!!!
By hj - 3 Years Ago
No, i copied your Avatar in the Base folder off cc and got the shown results
By hj - 3 Years Ago
Hi 3Dtest

i have publish your tool-information in the german section of the forum.

https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/5670f98c-fe42-476b-b875-2d1d.gif

Thank you for this great tool.

best
hj
By 3Dtest... - 3 Years Ago

Hi Folks, just to let everyone know that following a positive discussion with Reallusion last week, I sent my latest AFP (advanced face puppet) system to them on Monday this week for testing/ evaluation.

Whether this new animation approach (or a derivation of it) will ultimately be incorporated into iClone, sold separately by RL, or whether I release this myself is yet to be decided - but I'll let everyone know the outcome as soon as I can via my YouTube channel, as well as this forum - meanwhile, thanks for bearing with me - as well as RL Smile

Regards - Mike (3Dtest)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKtjihhZQ_qmxEmbBzxt-nQ