|
By hcameron90 - 10 Years Ago
|
Is there a way to animate g5 or even g6 avatar tongues?
For instance making the avatar lick their lips etc.
|
|
By animagic - 10 Years Ago
|
|
There was actually quite some discussion about that in iClone 5 days. The answer is "Yes" (at least for G5 characters), as the tongue became animatable. It involves preparing the movements in 3DXchange using the Expression Editor. Earlier someone had created a tongue prop (Cricky, I believe). I'll check tonight, unless someone beats me to it. In the meantime, you could try to search for "Tongue" in the iClone 5 section of the forum.
|
|
By theschemer - 10 Years Ago
|
I found this:
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
I never tried it and don't know if it will fit your needs.
TS
|
|
By Lost Filmmaker - 10 Years Ago
|
|
theschemer (1/12/2015)
I found this:
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
I never tried it and don't know if it will fit your needs.
TS
Nope, that's just wrong
|
|
By animagic - 10 Years Ago
|
|
In IC 5.5 or thereabouts, tongue bones were added to the G5 standard characters. I have played a little bit with that at the time. This is the procedure: You will need 3DXchange to prepare your standard character. Load your character, and then open the Expression Editor (option is on the right side). Click the Custom tab: 
Notice that you can define Custom motion groups (up to 6) with motions that are controlled by moving the mouse in different directions. For each direction, you specify a target pose. In my screen capture I'm using the left mouse movement of Group 1 to move the tongue to the left (from our perspective). This pose is actually built from a number of poses: - slightly open the jaw
- move the tongue outward
- rotate the tongue to the left
Once you are satisfied with the pose, you can retain it by clicking Set. Repeat this for other poses, such as moving the tongue to the right and sticking out the tongue. Export the character back to iClone (or click Apply to iClone). In iClone select the Facial Puppet and then select the Custom Group you just specified: 
Note that iClone does not show what you selected (a bug!), but it's there. For some reason also, selecting a custom group causes the eyes to be selected as well...:unsure: When you deselect those, your group selection is no longer indicated, but it is there. Now you can test the tongue motions by moving the mouse. I hope this helps someone...:P
|
|
By hcameron90 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Ah thanks appreciate the tip!
|
|
By animagic - 10 Years Ago
|
|
hcameron90 (1/13/2015)
Ah thanks appreciate the tip!The tip of the tongue...:P
|
|
By Cricky - 10 Years Ago
|
Lost Filmmaker (1/12/2015)
theschemer (1/12/2015)
I found this:
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
I never tried it and don't know if it will fit your needs.
TSNope, that's just wrong
Why is that just wrong? It has bones that allow posable modification, and came out long before models had them built in.
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
|
|
By Lost Filmmaker - 10 Years Ago
|
Cricky (1/14/2015)
Lost Filmmaker (1/12/2015)
theschemer (1/12/2015)
I found this:
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
I never tried it and don't know if it will fit your needs.
TSNope, that's just wrong Why is that just wrong? It has bones that allow posable modification, and came out long before models had them built in. http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
But you can't say it doesn't look disturbingly weird
|
|
By Cricky - 10 Years Ago
|
Lost Filmmaker (1/14/2015)
Cricky (1/14/2015)
Lost Filmmaker (1/12/2015)
theschemer (1/12/2015)
I found this:
http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613
I never tried it and don't know if it will fit your needs.
TSNope, that's just wrong Why is that just wrong? It has bones that allow posable modification, and came out long before models had them built in. http://city.reallusion.com/ContentPreview.aspx?i=JIC8f981969ba22f5613 But you can't say it doesn't look disturbingly weird
If your mind goes there.. I suppose it would look weird. It is animated to show the smooth flow of the mesh if animated or posed.
Some say a demo should show enough animation to show its ability, some say too much, some say not enough. Can't satisfy all, I say.
When you look at it, think Ice Cream Cone on a hot day. Just a matter of perspective.
It was originally designed with Jimmy Toons as the target Avatar. I applied it to Chuck for the demo, and I just recently applied it to Mason in iClone6 to test it, and it works with him too.
It works for all Standard or Non-Standard characters. Perhaps you would you have preferred Heidi or Gwynn?
It's just animated meshes regardless of the perspective.
I thank you for your comments. :)
|
|
By spacetourist - 10 Years Ago
|
animagic (1/13/2015)
You will need 3DXchange to prepare your standard character. Load your character, and then open the Expression Editor (option is on the right side). Click the Custom tab: Notice that you can define Custom motion groups (up to 6) with motions that are controlled by moving the mouse in different directions.
Thanks for the helpful explanation animagic.
I'm still trying to translate common blend shape terms to iclone.... So basically, if I import a custom character I will only get
-standard head jaw eyes lips movement
-limited move-able muscle zone
-limited to 6 custom expressions (!)
The last one is problematic if it's true... I have purchased and custom made hundreds of daz model expressions!
The process of importing external OBJ or FBX blend shapes is standard enough. But where do the imported 3dexchange face expressions sliders go in iclone? I googled it everywhere but still can't any info on how to load 3dex imported custom genesis face expression as 'poses' into iclone....
Even if I could get more than 6 custom expressions into iclone 6, I still wouldn't want to set up puppeteer for all 350 of them!
Nevermind iclone 5 or 3dex 5, most importantly will iclone 6 have blend shape or at the least have face morph sliders or expression poses?
Thanks for any guidance....
|
|
By animagic - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Right now, Visemes are the only category with sliders, so right now you can not map other custom blend shapes in a one-to-one fashion. I don't know what options there will be in 3DXchange 6.
|
|
By Cricky - 10 Years Ago
|
|
animagic (1/17/2015)
Right now, Visemesare the only category with sliders, so right now you can not map other custom blend shapes in a one-to-one fashion.
I don't know what options there will be in 3DXchange 6.
It would seem that is the case, but if the bones of the tongue are mapped to the Jaw, they also can be edited as part of the Viseme blending inside 3dXchange5. If the nose had bones and you wanted to add that as part of the Jaw, it could be blended also. Any part that is not used otherwise in the base configuration could be used as long as it is weighted.
The issue is that once done, it does not always remember the settings for the bones positions for later use, but remembers the morphs applied by key sliders. It can be reused for the exact same character, but not for another with the same bone set because of the bone edits, so editing of the bones will have to be done again.
|
|
By spacetourist - 10 Years Ago
|
Thanks for the info. Iclone has really original ways of animating motions from the neck down. But the facial animation side, especially emotional variety it is grossly under-developed compared to others.
The 'fix' using bones and 3dex is clever but too much work for one very basic animation step. In carrara or blender or max or maya, if I need a face emotion and can't get it out of my hundred morph sliders, I just move the face directly on the mesh in one click.
Blend shape is standard face anim, 6 custom canned face emotion template is big problem, no direct morphing on mesh makes it a bigger problem, no way to save reusable emotions from iclone....wow. This kind of 'lack' reminds me that iclone is made for consumers....
But iclone looks like it is taking anim seriously. I hope they will will blend shapes (sliders, double click to load poses, or as additional custom puppeteer preset) to future updates. I'll keep track on 3dex6 development. Thanks again.....
|
|
By R Ham - 9 Years Ago
|
Thanks to your blurb, Animagic, I was able to get this to work. I won't win any prizes for finesse, but without your help I would have been SOL.
Hats off.
................................
|
|
By animagic - 9 Years Ago
|
|
Rottenham (2/8/2016)
Thanks to your blurb, Animagic, I was able to get this to work. I won't win any prizes for finesse, but without your help I would have been SOL.
Thanks for reporting back. I'm glad it helped!
|
|
By R Ham - 9 Years Ago
|
OK, I've been fooling with animating the tongue for a couple of days, and I've made some progress. Now I'm seeing something I don't want, but I don't know how to stop it.
The (6) 3DX_Custom buttons in the iClone 6 Face Puppet all have default head and eye motions built into them. How to turn these off? If I deselect the unwanted features in the Solo Feature Selection panel, the custom button itself is deselected. Reselect the custom button, and the unwanted Solo features return. This happens even when there are no custom actions associated with a button, so I am thinking this is associated with iClone, rather than 3DX. I understand it may be impossible to turn these motions off, but it never hurts to ask. :-) Thanks...
|
|
By animagic - 9 Years Ago
|
|
That is indeed bizarre and confusing. What happens (or should happen) is that the custom feature is still selected after the others are deselected. It's just not indicated.
|
|
By R Ham - 9 Years Ago
|
|
animagic (2/13/2016)
That is indeed bizarre and confusing. What happens (or should happen) is that the custom feature is still selected after the others are deselected. It's just not indicated.
Yes it is. No matter how I go about it, clearing the unwanted motions from the MODIFY | ANIMATION | MOTION | FACE PUPPET | 3DX_Custom | Solo Features Selection panel disables the Preview/Record buttons of the selected control.
Today I'm going to try one more thing. The iClone EDIT | FACIAL FEATURES panel does a nice job of moving the tongue without introducing unwanted head and eye movements. I'm wondering what would happen if I saved a single frame of this effect as a motion clip, then called it into a clean timeline somewhere downstream. Would this become an animation? If not, I may have to give up getting Chuck to eat. Your comment is invited.
|
|
By animagic - 9 Years Ago
|
I know that MotionPlus saves facial animation (it's a Collect Clip option), so you could try if just saving a snippet at the point where the tongue is where you want it would work. I have never tried using it that way, but it may be worth a shot.
EDIT: See my next post for a far easier solution.
I haven't used Custom morphs in the Facial Puppet in IC6, so I would have to check. It worked in IC5, that when deselecting the unwanted features, the custom one would still work even though it wasn't indicated. If it doesn't work like that in IC6 it's definitely a bug rather than an annoyance.
|
|
By animagic - 9 Years Ago
|
OK, so the behavior between IC5 and IC6 differs. In both cases, extra features are selected when selecting a custom feature. The difference is that in IC5 you can deselect all solo features, and the custom feature will still be active. In IC6 that is not the case.
As a workaround, keep a single solo feature selected.
Click the icon in the lower right corner to open the Edit Property panel.
For the selected solo feature, set the contribution to "1".
Changes in the solo feature will hardly be noticeable, but you will be able to use the custom feature, as the Preview and Record buttons are still available:
I'm showing off a nice snarl that I created in IC5...:crazy:
|
|
By R Ham - 9 Years Ago
|
|
animagic (2/13/2016)
I know that MotionPlus saves facial animation (it's a Collect Clip option), so you could try if just saving a snippet at the point where the tongue is where you want it would work. I have never tried using it that way, but it may be worth a shot.
I haven't used Custom morphs in the Facial Puppet in IC6, so I would have to check. It worked in IC5, that when deselecting the unwanted features, the custom one would still work even though it wasn't indicated. If it doesn't work like that in IC6 it's definitely a bug rather than an annoyance.
After watching 3Dtest's vid I experimented with MotionPlus, but I didn't get what I was looking for. I haven't looked at morphs yet, but I will.
I did find that so long as one FP facial feature was enabled - any one - preview/record was available. So, I used expression editor to do the tongue, then in FP I enabled the chin. Voila. Jaw drops, mouth opens, tongue sticks out, eye and head movements are absent. I'd like to disappear the bottom teeth, but I haven't figured out how to access them in 3DX yet. I'm just learning what this program can do and where the buttons are. I don't want to pivot on this tongue thing, there's a whole lot more I need to learn. Thanks animagic.
|
|
By elliespotter - 9 Years Ago
|
A quick thank you to Animagic ...
Excellent advice here and a lot easier to do than to explain. Thank you.
|
|
By Bazookaz - 9 Years Ago
|
is there anyway i could do the same thing with daz models using this
https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/tongue-controls-for-genesis-3-female-characters/110445
|
|
By pumeco - 9 Years Ago
|
It would be good if we could drag the tongue around like a snake to animate using the Edit Motion Layer feature.
|
|
By Bazookaz - 9 Years Ago
|
|
how can i do that in iclone??
|
|
By Rampa - 9 Years Ago
|
If you install this mod from 3DTest, you get some pretty good tongue controls. It is only for CC characters though, not G5. The download is in the comments.
RL has a new system for iC7, but we'll have to wait until they're ready to show us.
|
|
By Bazookaz - 9 Years Ago
|
|
well i normally export my characters out of daz and normally use hair from the daz shop with genesis 3 and sometimes 2 models mostly
|