Besides BB's latest offerings, I wouldn't necessarily consider all current content in the Market Place suitable for children of all ages if that is the issue. Again proper marking would help here.

BTW, I'm also opposed to the tendency to equate nudity with pornography as in recent discussions. Certain puritan sentiments strike me as hypocritical.

[Link Removed By Moderator: Please Don't Post Discussion From Private Beta Forum on the Public Forum]

Too many two-faced people if you ask me.

Comments can be seen, such as, "ha ha ha , bout time, priceless...


Personally the way I see it, two faced people can shove it as far up as they can. Stop trying to be so righteous and mind your own business and children.

I think your minds take you straight to the bad side of a subject in an attempt to ridicule what you were afraid to address in the first place because you yourself have Black Hearts.

If you are a parent, watch your kids,
If you give them a credit card to spend on your account, it's your doing.
Start being a parent.

Stop trying to guide grown people on your bend of a subject as "evil" when you yourself are likely the one thinking about the wrong thing..

I hope they aren't the pre-cursor to further motions depicting sexual activity :unsure:.

My comment re; damage to Reallusion's reputation in the other Thread, refers.

If any Content Developer wants to produce this type of content, it should be upon private individual requests & transactions, IMO.

Please see the Forum Rules HERE for clarification.

I've just read through this thread, and the even longer thread in the Marketplace forum.

Being one of the first to have posted that I had conveyed my objections regarding the content offered for sale to RL I feel in only fair to elaborate on my reasons.

The main reason was the fact that the product was being advertised on an age unrestricted, public forum. The product itself is not objectionable, however the embedded motions - and the unmistakeable description of them, made it quite obvious that the target audience was very clearly defined. At the time I did not think that this was an audience that RL is striving to attract - what with all their learning tutorials for their products being very heavily geared towards educators. However the deafening silence from RL leads me to think that their interest lies more in making money that adhering to their own EULA.

Maybe if we start adding comments to their Facebook page - where they can't delete them at will, then we will get at least a company policy statement, or a new EULA.   

Please see the Forum Rules HERE for clarification.

You can have "very romantic" scenes without requiring the explicit display enabled by that prop.

It was reported by Doug (Mythical Dragon) that BigBoss is removing the item.  But that's only temporary as the issue will return.  Another day, another developer, another product.  The "Pole Dancing" set isn't quite at the same level, but demonstrates this situation will happen again.

Overall, I feel the best compromise is to relegate it a "back room" where it's not likely to be stumbled up on by casual shoppers just browsing.  Similar to the "Girls Gone Wild" example given earlier, it's one thing for a store to sell "family planning" products, but you don't need to have a graphic display right in the entry of the store when you walk in with your children.

Not "that" much different from Reallusion's Nude G3 Characters, Sen ;)

The Complaints lodged with Reallusion & in this & the Marketplace Threads, refer to the Animations. Therefore your Post is irrelevant, IMO. ;) 

Firstly, I find absolutely nothing wrong with an anatomically correct depiction of the human body, both male & female, in the 3D world. 

The human body has long been considered beautiful (Michelangelo, Da Vinci, Belini, Raphael, et al created accurately depicted nudes long before any of us ever did).  There are even anatomically correct nude sculptures in the Vatican (the ones covered with plaster fig leaves are due to one crazy pope who in a crazed fit went & chopped off the male members one night - though he didn't get all of them, fortunately).  One can purchase anatomically correct baby dolls for their children at toy stores - if they so choose. 

The nude human form is not, in my mind (nor the Vatican's it seems) pornographic in & of itself.

That being said, I do however have difficulty in finding any purpose other than explicit pornography, for the use of animation that depicts sexual erection of the male phallus. I can not for the life of me think of a single use for such animation other than creating explicit sexual video.

I have no problem with any developer, artist, sculptor, etc.,  whether it be here at RL, in a public museum, gallery or on any other 3D content site, creating anatomically correct human depictions.  I find no problem with the creation of BB's anatomically correct male form. I do however, take exception to the animation of the model's phallus into sexually explicit posing - that, in my view, is blatantly sexually explicit.

As a side note - there are laws in place (at least here in the US) such as the CA Child Protection Act, that prohibit the public accessibility of sexually explicit material being publically available & requiring age-restrictive access. As a parent & grandparent, I have no problem with my children or grandchildren viewing the nude human form, I do however object to them being able to publically see, read about or purchase and use explicit sexual animation of human body parts.

As adults, we should all realize that everyone has the right to their own opinions, and concur that we all can agree to disagree.

RL, is the corporate fiduciary who controls the governance of their site & marketplace. They have the oversight ability to manage the site in accordance with all pertaining rules, policies, mandates & legislation. Though we may all "weigh in" with our opinions, it is, in the end, RL's decision and stance that will determine the final outcome of this discourse.

While discussion of the subject is fine, please refrain from explicit language, explicit descriptions, posting nude or explicit images and other associated sexual innuendo. Please also refrain from attacking other forum members who may have different views than yourself.

I'm sure then we can all get along just fine. ;)

EDIT: Just to add BigBoss is wisely removing the product that caused all this heated discussion in the first place. We will also be reviewing other content in the Marketplace that has been mentioned to see if any of it breaches our Content EULA. Once I have more feedback on this I will update again.

Thanks for your understanding.

@Sen - no problem whatsoever - I harbor no ill will towards you or any other developer, user or RL employee. Also, thank you for your nice compliments regarding my products, that was very sweet.

For the record for others reading this Thread:

My Posts in this Thread were moderated in addition to Cricky's.

IMO, that moderation was fair & equitable.

There wasn't any "telling lies" or "cursing" in my Posts, as intimated by Cricky.

ADDED - Having read Cricky's Post below, I add that in future, I won't be responding to any of Cricky's inflammatory Posts. I'll leave that to others.

Insulting Other Users
Posts clearly insulting other members are not allowed. This includes, but is not limited to name calling, direct insults, accusations or making insinuations about others.

There are those who have Posted in this Thread & those who have not, who would not agree with your statement

Unfortunately some have already been "chased-away" over the last couple of years or so, who've either been Flamed by one Forum Member or have got fed-up with his inflammatory behavio(u)r.:ermm: 

Respected Forum Member Ben Tuttle's last Post in this Thread confirms that Member's inflammatory behavio(u)r. Like-wise Warlord's Post sometime-ago, directed at that Member.

Ben Tuttle's, Warlord's & all other Forum Members who've complained about that Member on this Forum, opinions should be considered.,

If the press suffered such boycotting nobody would buy the papers.

S/

I wonder who you could mean? :Whistling:

Seriously Cricky you write a long post about all the unfair treatment but the solution is simple. Just abide by the Forum Rules HERE, and in particular how you talk to other forum members, and we have no problem.

Maybe you don't realise you are doing it, but can you really not see that calling people dumb, telling them to learn to read, and saying things like "you are some piece of _ _ _ _. You fill in the blanks" is not being offensive? And that is just in this thread alone.

Straight talking is one thing but you simply go too far. Why not try to enjoy the forum and the community. I'm sure there is fun, cheery Cricky inside the aggressive and angry one we see far too often these days.

I believe the product has been removed from sale but the page may still remain for now. BigBoss did state he would remove it so hopefully it will be gone soon.

Thanks for the update, Peter :)

Although Chinese artist Ai Weiwei is one of the most prolific, provocative and significant artists at work today, audiences in North America have had little exposure to his vast and varied output. That will change this summer, when the AGO becomes the only Canadian stop on a North American tour that is already drawing crowds — and controversy — at the Smithsonian’s Hirshhorn Museum in Washington, D.C.

Sad then that last year saw the arrest of a man who simply used Art to portray his ideas of Artistic freedom to motivate its audience to an awareness that was otherwise politically missing.

Sad also that Qu Lei Lei also suffered at the hands of similar Governmental paranoia regarding Art used to assist social awareness of miscarriages of justice underground the very society that walked in false freedoms.

S.

It's very, very simple.  At least to me.

"Social norms."

It is risky for a company to violate social norms.  It tends to be bad for business.

It is challenging enough in one country, and even more difficult when you are operating globally.

If you try to go right down the middle, some people will think you are offensively prudish, and others will think you are offensively salacious.

So why all the fuss about one particular biological organ?  Sexuality versus violence?  Good question.  My answer again is simply, "Social norms."  I'm not going to defend them, nor campaign against them.  But you have to acknowledge them.

Why is it when a woman lifts her shirt to expose herself, the guys around cheer, but if a guy drops his pants and exposes himself, the women go, "Ewww, gross!"?  (Generally speaking, at least in the society I live in.)  Isn't that biased and unfair?

I think Reallusion is trying to maintain a "respectable" image as a business, based on their social norms.  As has been pointed out, someone can go open their very own store, not associated with any Reallusion web site, and can probably sell props or avatars like what started this firestorm.  Or it could be done on a more private basis.

Reallusion (and this community here) can maintain certain standards for conduct and appearance on the web sites they control.  It doesn't mean they're condemning alternative viewpoints, but they don't have to support or implicitly endorse them.

In closing... I have to say I understand the healthy debate on this topic.  But not the vitriol, excessive emotion, and personal attacks.  Can we please all act like adults while discussing this adult topic?