A lot of longtime users are complaining about not getting a better deal on IC8 and CC4.
I would like to know what price longtime users want to pay for IC8 and CC4.
It is only fair to let us know what you want to pay for the new products.
RL may lose a lot of new customers if there is a price difference for new customers than longtime customers.

Oh, I don't think it will matter one whit what WE think about the pricing - RL does what it does.  And perhaps all this pricing pain wouldn't be there if they had actually worded their offers better.

But since you asked, let's lay it out pretty simple.  Right now a new user can get 7 and 3 for around $800 AND get the upgraded versions when they come out.  Those of us who bought 7 and 3 AND 3DX need to pay exactly the same price to get the upgraded versions.  True, we had more use out of them for a few years, but we also financed RL for that period of time.  I think paying half of what a new user does is fair - so around $400.

This is in line with most other software companies but if they only wanted to discount it to, say, 35% off it still shouldn't be $800 - it should be, then, around $500.  Again, fair and I would think that would treat all of us loyal customers fairly.

Again, lest someone point out that you get "free" content when you spend $800 - that's bullshit.  Those of us loyal customers have already BOUGHT all the content over the years, all the plugins, all the great marketplace and store stuff.  The only way we would get "free" content is to get stuff we don't need now.  So folks who did NOT support RL by buying content DO get a good deal now.  Just not the rest of us. (This could be addressed fairly simply by just taking into account ALL that we've paid over the last couple of years and NOT just a small period of time - I've spent thousands over that period of time and yet I still have to pay the same price as someone who didn't buy a thing).

The truly ironic thing is it DID look like RL was offering us that deal - offering us 8 and 4 for $400 or so.  But, of course, they didn't mean what they wrote.

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Alienware Aurora R16, Win 11, i9-149000KF, 3.20GHz CPU, 64GB RAM, RTX 4090 (24GB), Samsung 870 Pro 8TB, Gen3 MVNe M-2 SSD, 4TBx2, 39" Alienware Widescreen Monitor
Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

This is not true Mike. Existing customers will pay $599 to get both iClone 8 and CC4 if they don't take part in the pre-sale offer. They do not need to spend $800 as you claim.


                                                                

Peter
Forum Administrator

www.reallusion.com

Ah, okay then we are getting around a 22% discount.  That's still less than any other company I know of, but not quite as horrible as I thought.

I did some searching around my various software (and I own thousands of dollars of things) and the SMALLEST discount I could find for upgrading was 33% - nearly all were 35-60%.  But, as I said, I will pay it albeit not happily.

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Alienware Aurora R16, Win 11, i9-149000KF, 3.20GHz CPU, 64GB RAM, RTX 4090 (24GB), Samsung 870 Pro 8TB, Gen3 MVNe M-2 SSD, 4TBx2, 39" Alienware Widescreen Monitor
Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

But remember it has been 4 years since the last major payable upgrade. Many companies offer new versions every year that have to be paid for. The discount from these companies may be a bit higher but you are having to do it every year with minimal new features added. Plus, in the case of iClone 8 and CC4 there are sure to be some tempting early bird offers at release time which may sweeten the deal. 


                                                                

Peter
Forum Administrator

www.reallusion.com

Thanks Peter. But I hope some good stuff will come to the the ones who already achieved the goal :-)

Merry Christmas!

iClone is my favorite software.  Nothing even comes close (well, CC :>.  And, yes, you are right that we've gotten enhancements that many companies would have charged for.

On my channel today, however, a new POTENTIAL user was looking at the RL landscape (and at some recommendations I made, like getting the 100 morphs package or whatever the heck it is) and said something to the effect "well, I see I have to buy a LOT of stuff like all these morphs and all these hairstyles just to be able to create characters" and while I did explain some things he could do to lessen the pain (like learning to make his own hair) he was hard to argue with.  Over the last four years I've spent thousands with RL - not just in content but in such things as Headshot and Skingen and Motion Live plugins to support the various equipment I've got.  And I will spend thousands more - but it's always nice to be appreciated as a long term user, and the offers (particularly the way they were wrongly worded) didn't feel like appreciation but more usury.  

I will hope that at release time those of us who are in similar positions get rewarded accordingly but, as I said, I will pay no matter what it is.  Mostly I was trying to represent those folks who may NOT pay, those (and I believe there are many) where RL will be leaving money on the table.

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Alienware Aurora R16, Win 11, i9-149000KF, 3.20GHz CPU, 64GB RAM, RTX 4090 (24GB), Samsung 870 Pro 8TB, Gen3 MVNe M-2 SSD, 4TBx2, 39" Alienware Widescreen Monitor
Mike "ex-genius" Kelley

I did not say much to this "topic"  but I definitely don't think 299,- (CC4) and 599,- (IC8) are too expensive,
they probably will remain 3 to 4 years till next major upgrade...
So, that's probably 100,- or 200,- a year. And Members pay less...
And there seem to be huge improvements in both versions. 
Sure, there could be some better deals for long-time customers, esp. those who bought curve editor and 3DXChange.
We will see what "tempting early bird offers" will look like ;-)
And the "buy content deal" is definitely a good thing for new customers.
I my case, I hardly find stuff I really want and don't own already.
What I definitely don't want is a subscription model !
Or, the "get updates for 365 days" shit like Hitfilm does...
So for me, no real reasons to complain.
And I'm glad I found CC3 and iClone at the end of 2015.
Without them my 3D journey might have been canceled... 

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I agree in most part with what Kelly has said.

To add my personal opinion, I believe RL has shown a lack of gratitude towards its long term user "of which I am not one" I have been using Motionbuilder, Maya, Daz and 3ds Max up until Covid lock down. When RL did the 50% discount on software It came at the same time I started an Indie development project, so I snapped up all the products bar the Unreal add-on, because I'm using Unity 

So I'm not a long term user but a heavily financially and Effort invested user who has seen your offer a £99 add-on, that can only be used with I8 as a slap in the face and a sign that you don't care about your core user base. So why would I want to stick around and become along term user knowing how they are treated?

People like Kelly Star dragon actually did more to help me get a custom too your oddly different terminology and workflow than RL has themselves. I do see a ton of Webinar invites and also YouTube videos, but they give a broad example that doesn't give me the answers I need. When I message the narrator I get no reply..But I ALWAYS get a reply from Kelly and Star dragon, even if it's a problem they can not solve. Yet they get the same offer as someone who bought 3d exchange a year ago, that's lame and shows NO effort.

Im going off topic now, so to answer your question, spend $ 500 before the end of Jan 2022 to get both CC4 and Iclone 8 or get 33% off retail price at launch. To qualify you must be a user of both CC3, I7 and 3d Exchange for over a year by the end of 2021.If you have only one or two of the mentioned softwares then you get 25% off at launch and no option to get for free if you spend $500 before end of Jan 2022.

Now I know this will still not suit everybody but If this was the original offer I would of been happier than I am now.