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Help With Materials

Posted By rickdarby 2 Years Ago
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rickdarby
rickdarby
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I have some nice models and maps exported from Daz Studio - some HD genesis 3 Characters. When i import them into iClone (i tried in ic 6 and in 7) they all look bad, i mean, not as good.

The characters have iray materials which have a bunch of different maps and apart from the diffuse and specular map, i can't seem to be able to use the others properly. Here's what i'm up against :
1) i have a bump map and a normal map - they are both used at the same time - in Daz, it looks perfect, in iclone, i'm only able to use just one of those maps for the bump channel(i tried using the bump map here - and i tried using the nomal map for displacement but that won't accept the "blue" style normal maps used in most 3d apps (i mean it will accept it but will morph the character beyond recognition). if i use the normal map for the bump channel the results will be extremely weak, no pores or lines are seen.
2) i have SSS maps - don't really know how to use them, on which material to use them
3) the AO material - i could not find absolutely no info or help about it
paulg625
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To the normal map issue after applying it use the settings to determine the amount 100% to 0% cut it down until happy with it. As to the others look at the PBR guide from Substance materials they explain the PBR flow and this will help with understanding the different maps. and There is a good tutorial on realllusion Utube about genesis import setting maps (not sure if updated for PBR but good info. 
rickdarby
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thanks for the reply.

the tuts (watched all of them) are not updated to reflect the pbr materials and there's no info anywhere (anywhere at all) about SSS and AO.

about the normal map, if i apply it to the bump channel, it's too weak, i am already at 100% strength with it and there's no way to increase more.

i had the same problem in unreal engine - had the 2 maps (bump and normal) but there i could overlap them - in iclone, it's just one map per channel.
justaviking
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iClone does not do Sub-Surface Scattering (SSS), so that map would be extraneous and discarded.
There are ways to fake or simulate SSS, such as adding a subtle glow map in certain places, but that applies better to stills where the lighting is constant, whereas in a video the character (or prop) may move relative to the lighting and it no longer looks correct.
Example:  When a person is brightly lit from behind, you can see some light through their ears.  So adding some pink-ish glow to parts of their ears can simulate SSS.  But then if the person turns his head, or even worse, walks into a dark room, it doesn't look right.  You don't want his ears glowing in the dark.



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rickdarby
rickdarby
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ok that makes sense - i'll have to ditch sss with iclone - not a huge problem.
but what about AO - what maps can i use there?

and what about my bump and normal maps? where can i use them both?
but0fc0ursee
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rickdarby (10/17/2017)
ok that makes sense - i'll have to ditch sss with iclone - not a huge problem.
but what about AO - what maps can i use there?

and what about my bump and normal maps? where can i use them both?

Hello,
It's important to understand how this works.. then you won't be confused to what goes where.

PBR... remeber this. "All maps are Black to White."
The various maps.... metallic, roughness, etc., etc.. are determined by, "SHADES OF GREY" applied to your map.

Example:
Diffuse Channel:
Diffuse map.... is you "Color Map"

Bump Channel:
To add the illusion of Depth.... 'Use a Normal map" DON'T USE A "BumpMap"
...to add to what paulg625 stated.... Start with a setting of (30).... and increase it to achieve the desired effect.
___________________________________________________________________________________

Render Options:
AO.... iClone uses HBA0+ (Superior Results) Rolleyes
make sure you turn on  "Temperal Anti Aliasing" before adjusting AO.

where is this?
Real-Time Render Options
Check Box - TAA (Shf +T)

Important:
Do NOT forget to use the "Bias" setting.... this baby fine-tunes the effect.
_______________________________________________________________________________

Metallic = ability to reflect imagery around it.
(Adjusted using "Shades of Gray"
Black = 0.... White = 100%
________________________________________________________________________________

Roughness = (Ability to reflect or absorb White light)
The more white your map is = Rougher
The more black your map is = Smoother

Hope this helps.
ROLL 'EMCool
wires
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Take a look at this video by Stuckon3d on importing various flavours of PBR materials into iClone:




Gerry



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paulg625
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Very well explained BOC thanks!!! 


but0fc0ursee (10/18/2017)
rickdarby (10/17/2017)
ok that makes sense - i'll have to ditch sss with iclone - not a huge problem.
but what about AO - what maps can i use there?

and what about my bump and normal maps? where can i use them both?

Hello,
It's important to understand how this works.. then you won't be confused to what goes where.

PBR... remeber this. "All maps are Black to White."
The various maps.... metallic, roughness, etc., etc.. are determined by, "SHADES OF GREY" applied to your map.

Example:
Diffuse Channel:
Diffuse map.... is you "Color Map"

Bump Channel:
To add the illusion of Depth.... 'Use a Normal map" DON'T USE A "BumpMap"
...to add to what paulg625 stated.... Start with a setting of (30).... and increase it to achieve the desired effect.
___________________________________________________________________________________

Render Options:
AO.... iClone uses HBA0+ (Superior Results) Rolleyes
make sure you turn on  "Temperal Anti Aliasing" before adjusting AO.

where is this?
Real-Time Render Options
Check Box - TAA (Shf +T)

Important:
Do NOT forget to use the "Bias" setting.... this baby fine-tunes the effect.
_______________________________________________________________________________

Metallic = ability to reflect imagery around it.
(Adjusted using "Shades of Gray"
Black = 0.... White = 100%
________________________________________________________________________________

Roughness = (Ability to reflect or absorb White light)
The more white your map is = Rougher
The more black your map is = Smoother

Hope this helps.
ROLL 'EMCool


rickdarby
rickdarby
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thanks @but0fc0ursee and @wires for your replies but i still have a problem - in daz studio i have a bump map and a normal map, they're used both at the same time. the normal map (blue one) and the bump map (grayscale). in unreal engine (which has identical pbr materials as iclone) i was able to combine the 2 maps and get the same effect as in daz studio.
but in iclone i can only use one map at a time - if i used the grayscale map i get some niche shadows and depth onto my character - but no fine details (scars, pores, etc), if i use the blue channel map i get the fine details but no shadows and very little depth on those details.
and for the actual normal map (the blue one) - it's already at 100% strength and the details are extremely weak - is there a way to go over 100%?
paulg625
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Are you applying the normal map as a Normal and adjusting it or as a bump? Because I usually, as ButOfCourse Said, when applying a Normal have to adjust it down to 30 to 40%. at 100% it's usually to strong. And I wonder if you put the Bump map in as a displacement map to get the scaring? 



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