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yes genesis 8 works just need a new Tpose

Posted By wendyluvscatz 7 Years Ago
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charleshoover885
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No thanks.

Charles
charleshoover885
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Kelleytoons (6/17/2017)

 I'd LIKE to see something, but so far people have posted things that look worse (like the video at the start of this thread)


This is a bit shrill.

Wendy,
I appreciate you getting out early on this thread.

Charles
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7 Years Ago by charleshoover885
will2power71
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Kelleytoons (6/17/2017)
Sorry if this might be a bit OT here, but can you folks who have gone this route explain to me (or show me -- that would be great) why you would bother?  Assuming, that is, you will be doing your rendering in iClone.
 


Kelleytoons, I can give you my perspective if you like. I have a lot of time and money invested in DAZ before I started to do anything with iClone. I actually calculated it out over time and my first purchase with DAZ in 2010. All totalled, it's more than a couple of thousand dollars in my case and I'm sure that I'm not alone in those dollar figures. The thing is with all that time and money invested, a lot of us have become attached to the figures we spend so much time with posing and rendering and well --we want to see them at their best. It's a widely held belief that DAZ's animation tools just aren't up to snuff and for the most part I agree. In fact, if they ever improved the DAZ studio animation tools, a lot of us might go back to it for animation because we wouldn't have to convert every asset and we could get all that detail with very little effort. But it seems that DAZ isn't interested in that so we're stuck looking for other solutions to get our characters moving. 

iClone provides that and more and for a lot of us it's enough just to be able to see the figures we've grown attached to live and breathe for us. Take Mike for example:


Mike is a character of mine and I have built her in V4, Genesis, Genesis 2 and Genesis 3. She has a backstory and is very near and dear to me. Just getting to see her in iClone had me on cloud 9 for six months but I want to give her the best that I can. But with the limitations of DAZ there were few options and a lot of trial and error. But with 3dxchange and iClone I can work out the animation and then bring it back into DAZ so that I can compile a high quality output. It's not about render time for me at this point but with the Octane plugin, I can get it down to about 20 seconds or so per frame with my setup. If I was doing a toon render, which is something that I love then I would more than probably do the render in iClone because I feel the toon render in iClone is superior to DAZ but if I want to go for realism, then I would render the final output in DAZ or maybe Carrara or maybe Cinema 4d or Modo. Most of us are getting used to moving back and forth between applications but I suppose it comes down to what the intent is on the user end. 

I am not down on the CC characters but the DAZ geometry in it's native app is more detailed. If you take the right approach, you don't have to lose any of that detail. I am now getting my feet wet in alembic export from DAZ and MDD from the Animate2 plugin for DAZ. I am working out a workflow where I set the scene up in DAZ and then I set up a very low poly proxy scene that I export to iClone. I export the DAZ figure in the scene and animate it in iClone before exporting the BVH back to DAZ where I can either render the scene or export the alembic to another application. I want the extra detail and this pipeline is a way to achieve the best result with a minimum of frustration. I'm not at home right now, but I will try to put together an example in the next week or so, so you can see exactly what I'm talking about.

I have it in my head that if I am not going to be doing any special effects, then I'll do the final result in DAZ. If I want to add fire or fog or something, then I'll do it in Cinema 4d or Modo with Octane render because I can achieve a consistent result whether I use DAZ or Cinema 4d. I just bought a 4TB drive to store alembic/MDD files. To me, the final result is just as important as the workflow so if it looks good in iClone, why not take advantage of Octane and the Redspec Shaders? 

Hell... Now I'm interested myself to see how this might turn out. 
knoble
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Hi will2power71 - Are you able to import facial animation from iClone into Daz?
will2power71
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knoble (6/17/2017)
Hi will2power71 - Are you able to import facial animation from iClone into Daz?

That depends on how it's done, I suppose. If it's strictly bone based, then I'm pretty sure there's a good chance that you can. If it's morph based --that might not be so good. You see, DAZ isn't very good with FBX imports. Some people have said that they have had successful imports but I haven't really heard or seen anything that would convince me that it's possible. You might be able to get away with it if you did an alembic export into Cinema 4D and converted the alembic animation into PLA (Point Level Animation) I remember the video on doing that for Cinema 4d but I'm not sure if it is possible in other applications. 



Since the Genesis 3 line has Facial bones, bone based animations could be exported as BVH and theoretically work. I have not tried it as of yet. Personally, If I were going to do it, I would use Genesis 3 Bundle Expressions & Face aniBlocks in DAZ and lyp sync from Mimic Live! along with Keymate and Animate2 to get the facial performance --but that's just me. I tend to believe you'll end up with less of a headache blocking the big motions in iClone and doing the facial expressions stuff in DAZ if you're planning on bringing everything back into DAZ Studio.
animagic
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I think we can at least agree that after a while everyone has their favorite tools and workflow, and one isn't necessarily better than the other. It's what you do with it in the end. (I tried to explain that to sw00000p once.)

iClone has its limitations too, but that's where I have invested a lot of money in over the years, so I certainly understand the investment aspect. You just hope that the company you deal with is responsive to user requests,  and RL has not disappointed me. You like to see the products you use evolve.


https://forum.reallusion.com/uploads/images/436b0ffd-1242-44d6-a876-d631.jpg

wendyluvscatz
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Kelleytoons (6/17/2017)

 I'd LIKE to see something, but so far people have posted things that look worse (like the video at the start of this thread)

that was just a quick day one test using basic content and I also only have the free starter essentials
added an autofitted outfit and skin texture.





wendyluvscatz
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wendyluvscatz (6/17/2017)
Kelleytoons (6/17/2017)

 I'd LIKE to see something, but so far people have posted things that look worse (like the video at the start of this thread)

that was just a quick day one test using basic content and I also only have the free starter essentials
added an autofitted outfit and skin texture.





all DAZ content in iClone
https://www.facebook.com/wendy5/videos/vb.1653360584/10212229346722863/?type=2&theater




Edited
7 Years Ago by wendyluvscatz
wendyluvscatz
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double post




Edited
7 Years Ago by wendyluvscatz
Kelleytoons
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Wendy -- I love you dearly (well, your presence here and the work I've seen you post) and I don't mean at all to denegrate what you posted at the start here, or even this latest (although I LOVE the way you did your crowds), but I still haven't seen anything done with Daz characters that is any better than what I've seen with CC ones.  I'm not saying they are bad at all, just not better (and in some cases, not as good).

I was just trying to see if the work and effort needed to bring these in was worth it, and at least for me I don't see how it is.  I'm sorry if I ruffled anyone's feathers because I certainly didn't mean to.  Every single person needs to decide what is best for their art, and it's unlikely that ANY solution will fit more than a few.  Animagic explains that quite well.

Willpower -- you answered the best.  If you have money (and energy and effort) invested in tools of course you want to leverage them any way you can.  And your gal, Mike (which kind of irritates me, as that's my name :>Wink does look pretty (love her eyes) but, again, nothing I couldn't see doing in CC (*someone* doing -- I'm not necessarily the greatest at doing anything in 3D).  But if I had spent my money on her I'd certainly want to use her (so to speak) and I'm really happy you can.

Again, not trying to rain on anyone's parade here.  Clearly Daz characters are not something I need concern myself with (but I'm ALWAYS willing to be proven wrong because that's how I get better tools.  And spend more money.  Sigh).





Alienware Aurora R16, Win 11, i9-149000KF, 3.20GHz CPU, 64GB RAM, RTX 4090 (24GB), Samsung 870 Pro 8TB, Gen3 MVNe M-2 SSD, 4TBx2, 39" Alienware Widescreen Monitor
Mike "ex-genius" Kelley
Edited
7 Years Ago by Kelleytoons

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