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Earth Sculptor tutors need work.

Posted By rampart 10 Years Ago
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animagic
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rampa (11/24/2014)
I don't have Photoshop either, but was able to do it in GIMP. So there is a free solution, at least.BigGrin

Great, I will try that! My approach works, but it is tedious, plus I tend to forget how I did it...Unsure


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Rampa
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animagic (11/25/2014)
rampa (11/24/2014)
I don't have Photoshop either, but was able to do it in GIMP. So there is a free solution, at least.BigGrin


Great, I will try that! My approach works, but itis tedious, plus I tend to forget how I did it...Unsure


It's been a while, I'll play with it some tonight and let you know what tricks I find work for me. I do remember an extra transparent layer, or something like that, being needed.

Paint.net might be a good option as well. Smile
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10 Years Ago by rampa
animagic
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As to terrain software, I like ES because it is intuitive to work with and has fast visual feedback, so you can see what you are doing.

I have had many versions of Bryce, but I find it frustrating. Same with Vue, although others swear by it.

I wouldn't dismiss free software out of hand. I've downloaded GIMP in the past and found the UI quirky, but if it can create masking files and I can avoid Photoshop, that is worth something. 


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animagic
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I have to dig, but the alpha channel is used for what is represented by black in the initial image, I believe. Then you have red, green, and blue for the other channels. There's trick to get that right and that is what I keep forgetting. I hope your method is a bit simpler.


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Rampa
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Well, I got distracted and downloaded Earth Sculptor. The free version has a 512 by 512 limit on output, but I believe that is within parameters for the current iC5 height map editor.

First note of importance is that the color/texture tool is best avoided for height map terrains, and only the "detail" map used for painting. You'll recognize the four channels in its palette. The reason to avoid it is because it will just be part of one big texture that cannot then be tiled or adjusted for vertical faces (UVW mapping).

Secondly, wherever you save your Earth Sculptor file is where the maps you need will end up. I just saved the file to my desktop (using "save" in the file menu) and then was able to just double-click the height map tiles to load the files I needed in iClone.

Thirdly, the color setting in ES is much better if you switch it to "multiply". You can find that setting in the "terrain" tool palette.
rampart
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I mentioned earlier about possibly making the effort to learn and acquire a better terrain building softrware.

I mentioned a few things I felt were missing in ES, things that I consider important.

Yes, creating ascent/descent with a flat surface are not accomplised easily using the level tool or ramp tool. It is trial and error process and it can take alot of time, because like clay as you try to fix things in one place it can be messing you up in other places.

How do you create a cliff, an overhang, or cave in the terrain? I cannot per-se do these things. I can do the cave in iclone with primitives or props, but not in the ES.

Yes, ES does accomodate flexibility, which is nice but the flexibility has a price. You cannot dimension or create the kind of symmetry in your development that really speeds up the process. It is like a child with Play Do, you just squeeze and push things around.

I tried to build an airport runway on a 1024 terrain. There is no way to assure you have any room for aircraft on the runway unless you actually place a real spec model on the runway to check it out. That is probably close enough in 90% of situations with 3D models. There is so much we can hide and workaround. You don't even need a real spec model when you can use the scale tool...but alas scaling those characters is a new set of problems.

This may seem remote, but what about pre-constucting a city on the terrain. All you would need is a tool to build box like structures and pull them out of the base. You wouldn't have to place a bunch of buildings on a terrain and waste all those resources, when all you need is a city to fly by. If you had the proper tools you could just wrap building textures around the elevated structures on your terrain. You could use the glow, specular etc,, to build night scenes etc. Think how much easier you could construct your terrains and include a large number things you do now with props. I mean it is pretty amazing what could be done just from the building of a terrain.

What about your roads and paths. If you had proper tools you could just paint the textures directly to the terrain. You could have highways and roads with markings from the textures and not have to place road props into your scenes. You think on that one, because it would be a huge time saver. It is so tedious, the place of road props onto terrain. Looking at a ES terrain it is extremely difficult to know the lay of the land from viewing in ES. Even if you could see changes in the elevations when you bring it into iclone it will change.

Have I said enough to spoil it for everyone? I hope I haven't spoiled it. I am merely speculating on glaring issues for me.

So, things can be done better and they may be more difficult to implement within 3D software. They cannot be ignored, if you progress with your craft.

I don't know Zip about a Bryce, VUE or any terrain builder software. It is strange how all of a sudden you have to do things and you have little or no choice, but to do them. Oops, I realize I don't have a software tools or content to do that.

There are things on the horizon, unseen. I've been in the land of iclone where I get spoon fed things that take me where I want to go with 3d animation, because basically I don't really know how far I can go. LOL

Some of the things I've mentioned should probably ring some bells for many readers. Seriously, an enormous amount of work with our projects can be done at the terrain (image map) level. We need a competent terrain building tool that allows us to go beyond basic ground elevations with the ability to replicate terrain items. By that I mean, if we were building a complex of buildings it would be a huge time saver to just copy and paste them onto the terrain and have them merge with the terrain. I suspect, a scultris or Earth Scultor type of molding/modeling tool is NOT a best final solution.

--------------------

Sorry for the long posting. I was thinking about a terrain with a city built into the terrain. It might be possible to take a 3D cad type program (sketchup) and construct the city. Then carefully place the city onto the terrain and merge it with the terrain. Then apply textures, and maps to it. You wouldn't have to have a city of course, but you could think in terms of the application of a large number of props combined within the source program possibly something like sketchup and apply to a terrain. The largest number of content items we use in iclone are props, and they are individually placed.

You could construct a local shopping center, with buildings, automobiles and other prop items alter it as you please with textures. This could save so much time. It would be understood that all your content items in this arrangement would be low-poly and have no construction details, except to accomodate external terxturing.

I rarely get an original idea, so I assume someone has already developed what I am talking about. It is probably just a matter of who has developed it and what it costs.

Yes, conceptually you might build an extremely low poly city with props in Sketchup then use the final compilation. The problem would be having the computer resources to accomplish such a thing separately. There is no way a 3DXchange with current capacity could accomplish such a migration into iclone.







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10 Years Ago by rampart
Rampa
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If you google "city generator" you'll find quite a bit.
rampart
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THe city thing was just an example of possible things that could speed up production.

If I could go into ES and pull up staight verticals like create a sqaure on the surface and then just pull it up Voila it becomes a building after you apply textures.



Rampa
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If you want overhangs, caves, etc., then a Z-Brush, Sculptris, 3D Coat should be able to help you. The most versatile type of terrain generator is a voxel based one. This is quite different than a heightmap like iClone and Earth Sculptor use.

A metaball modeler is another option.

Just some ideas to check out, as the rabbit hole seems to be beckoning to you. Smile

rampart
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Hmm..

I appreciate the recommendations on terrain. I didn't realize how far down " that rabbit hole goes". My gosh there are so many terrain tools it is mind numbing, or more numbing in my case. Looks like a best course of action for me is work towards this slowly and continue with the ES.

The DAZ3d tools are free for the most part, and Carrara Pro is on sale at $171. That is attractive price IMO. I haven't read or viewed much about Carrara, but NL2012 did use it in one of his videos in a terrain video and it was impressive.

The DAZ3d has always sort of baffled me. I say that for my own reasons. I have always been confused about the applications. DAZ3D Studio Pro, Carrara Pro, Bryce, Hexagon, etc. It seems Carrara and Daz3d Studio do some of the same things the other application does (maybe not as well). The Daz3D studio Pro looks to be a super application, which I always thought. Now it is free and Carrara Pro is for payment software. It is a bit confusing, deciding which is the better choice.

Don't get me wrong, it isn't about the money. It is about the time and efforts to learn the software. It has taken me 2 years to get a reasonable sense of how to use iclone. So, in my thinking it is better to work with what you know and ooooze into something else.

This terrain thing has hit my hot button of late. I hope this thread has been as beneficial to others as it has to me. There are some excellent (workable) information postings.










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